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Post by Ava on Dec 1, 2022 17:54:19 GMT
Thanks lumina . You were posting as I was editing, but I appreciate and agree with your thoughts there. I am going to check my previous draconic SRs and see what I can make of them. Edit: Pretty interesting study, like one pivotal year had sun tightly conjunct Pluto in the draco SR, with SR draco Uranus on my draco moon. The year I met my husband, draco SR Pluto right on my natal draco DSC, and it was my draco Jupiter return, plus other stuff. One tragic year had SR draco Pluto on my natal draco Saturn/tropical Neptune conjunction.
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Post by lumina on Dec 1, 2022 21:19:41 GMT
Ava I agree with your edit there. For me it is also first and foremost interesting in terms of synastry and prediction possibly. Also the concept of soul is very abstract to me too, and therefore not really applicable, at least not for me. I think your take to see it as "challenges" is in the very least a very good working hypothesis and we can take it from there. For me The Draco synastry resonates with two sentences, though this still might be a little too abstract as well. "Become who you are" and "You remind me of who I really am". To me it often feels, if I am in contact with people whose tropical chart overlays my Draco, like I am realizing: "Oh right, that is inside of me as well. Or that is how I could be at least." Like something that is underneath, and can be digged up again, but might have been buried under a lot of other stuff. Actually when I look at my Draconic chart I see the child I was in it to a large degree (before I learned to adapt myself to fit better into society, also called education I suppose. lol) It`s possible though that this is just an unique feature of my Draconic chart, and might not be the case for other people. Still that kind of "being reminded" would actually fit nicely into the lunar symbolism, as the Moon is also often described as being symbolic of our "memory", not in a Mercurial intellectual kind of way, but that kind of emotional memory. But as you said, the psychology of it all eludes me to a great degree. Anyway let me know what you figure out about your Solar Returns. BTW Draco version of your Solar Return or the time the transiting Draco Sun is conjunct your natal Draco Sun? EDIT I just saw your edit. Wow! That is very impressive.
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Post by Ava on Dec 2, 2022 14:58:52 GMT
BTW Draco version of your Solar Return or the time the transiting Draco Sun is conjunct your natal Draco Sun? On this thread, I'm talking about the transiting draconic sun conjunct natal draconic sun. Astro-seek offers this chart calculation. However, they do base it on the mean node. (Whenever I list my draconic placements it's based off the true node, astro.com's default setting. In my case there's a 1° difference.) Astro-seek > Free Horoscopes > Draconic Astrology Calculator > Draconic Solar Return. To change the year, click "(Enter solar year manually)" above the placement listings on the right. I haven't checked my whole life, just selected a few standout years at first. Now I'm looking at 2019-2020 for the first time. This was in effect when Covid began and draco SR Chiron is tightly conjunct my draco ASC. The SR features sun exactly conjunct Mars (again, mean node calculation) and Saturn almost exactly on the south node, < 0°30' . I had an extremely difficult time with that, emotionally. "To me it often feels, if I am in contact with people whose tropical chart overlays my Draco, like I am realizing: 'Oh right, that is inside of me as well. Or that is how I could be at least.'" Yes I think it's about something deeper and "interior."
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Post by Ava on Dec 2, 2022 22:46:31 GMT
Sorry for my edits, tr Mercury square Neptune is really throwing me off lately.
But let me try and say something again:
As for the draconic version of the tropical solar return chart, the draconic sun moves forwards about 19°/year. Meaning the draconic "year" is 19 days shorter than a regular year.
So the transiting draconic sun forms a conjunction with that draconized SR chart's sun about 19 days before one's next birthday.
It's like that every year for everyone. In my case, your birthday is around three weeks before mine. Hence your tropical SR sun, when converted to draconic, will always be almost the same as mine was, that same year. (For you in 2022, 13 Scorpio. For me in 2022, 15 Scorpio.)
So we sort of have a solar return around the same time, just different varieties (yours is real, mine's an astro-invention that nobody pays attention to, not that I know of.)
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Post by lumina on Dec 2, 2022 22:49:22 GMT
Ava"Astro-seek offers this chart calculation. " Oh I did not know that. Thank you. However, they do base it on the mean node. (Whenever I list my draconic placements it's based off the true node, astro.com's default setting. In my case there's a 1° difference.)" I usually use my true Node as well, however there is not that much of a difference for me either, I think the difference is about 15 minutes or even less, it does however in the Draconic chart put some planets on the next degrees, but it`s really not that much of a difference I think. This was in effect when Covid began and draco SR Chiron is tightly conjunct my draco ASC. The SR features sun exactly conjunct Mars (again, mean node calculation) and Saturn almost exactly on the south node, < 0°30' . I had an extremely difficult time with that, emotionally." Wow, it is amazing how much that fits! And beside the emotional difficulties, it also put you into a "fight-mode" (at least in the sense of resistance or protectiveness, and I do see that Sun-Mars at play in that, and obviously also Saturn for the steadfastness.
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Post by lumina on Dec 2, 2022 22:50:55 GMT
not quoting everything in your last post, but that is so fascinating about our matching Solar Returns.
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Post by Ava on Dec 2, 2022 23:33:41 GMT
not quoting everything in your last post, but that is so fascinating about our matching Solar Returns. My SR in 2025 features the NN @ 0 Aries so the tropical and draconic version of the tropical SR are almost identical. So for your birthday in 2025, you get to be me almost (your SR, draconized, will have the sun close to my natal sun), and then I get to be me again. Actually if I have your chart right, your SR sun is on the DSC that year, so it's a good time to love yourself. (And me, of course. Just kidding but how could I not say that.)
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Post by lumina on Dec 3, 2022 11:27:25 GMT
Ava Fascinating. 2025 seems to be a year for you where you might be very much aligned with yourself, I mean even the more inner stuff of the draconics coming to the surface very naturally. Yeah I seem to remember in some year I was going to have Sun on DESC, I think conjunct Venus or something, might be that year, but in the same year, if I recall it right, I also have Saturn square all that. So there you go. lol And certainly yes, not even a question. Hmm I just had a look only at the Draco Solar Return (on astroseek) in the year I first met P. Standout to me is this: SR IC 21 Aqua SR Jupiter 19 Aqua n Uranus 22 Aqua - angular Jupiter-Uranus, definitely matching, I mean it was a very liberating year where I was doing new stuff, like it was only then that I started to go on trips on my own. Another thing I notice was that SR Uranus was not tightly conjunct Sun, but in between Sun and Venus. n Sun 16 Aries SR Uranus 21 Aries n Venus 26 Aries ------------ Also wide Venus-Neptune near my natal Mars-ASC, close, but not close enough I guess. SR Venus 21 Pisces SR Mercury 19 Pisces SR Neptune 25 Pisces n Mars Mars 25 Pisces n ASC 27 Pisces obviously SR Neptune was conjunct n Mars exactly (draconically) and I htink that fits too.
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Post by lumina on Dec 3, 2022 11:42:55 GMT
My SR for 2026 (so for that mentioned birthday) looks pretty, I don`t know, I hesitate to say, cool, with the Saturn-Neptune-conjunction square Sun-Venus on the DESC. lol However looks like an envelope that opens to that Saturn-Neptune, here is the Draconized version of it
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Post by Ava on Dec 3, 2022 19:46:58 GMT
lumina, Isn't that chart great? Capricorn is ambitious and greedy, so I'm glad your sun there is conjunct Venus, Mars, Juno and the DSC. (Because why NOT have it all?) Well things look exciting and maybe off-kilter with moon as chart ruler opposing Uranus, but the envelope will probably stabilize things, especially with Saturn elevated like that. But it might be a whole different world by then. Curious that you have a kind of double whammy here, with not only a Cap sun but Saturn on your natal draco sun. "Fascinating. 2025 seems to be a year for you where you might be very much aligned with yourself, I mean even the more inner stuff of the draconics coming to the surface very naturally." Hope so. "And certainly yes, not even a question." "SR IC 21 Aqua SR Jupiter 19 Aqua n Uranus 22 Aqua" Aw! "angular Jupiter-Uranus, definitely matching, I mean it was a very liberating year where I was doing new stuff, like it was only then that I started to go on trips on my own." So glad it worked out this way. Now I think of you as having a whole life in theater that's your "home away from home." Expanding the meaning of home. "Another thing I notice was that SR Uranus was not tightly conjunct Sun, but in between Sun and Venus. n Sun 16 Aries SR Uranus 21 Aries n Venus 26 Aries" I love how it matches your experience, all of this.
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Post by lumina on Dec 4, 2022 11:29:58 GMT
Ava"(Because why NOT have it all?)" Haha, right. In the tropical Version the DESC is on 24 Sag. Well things look exciting and maybe off-kilter with moon as chart ruler opposing Uranus," Moon giving me a bit of HU?-thoughts, in the tropical SR it is on 29 Scorpio, which to me seems possibly very challenging degree, the tightest aspect in the whole Solar Return is actually the Moon on 29 Scorpio trine Neptune on 29 Pisces, with just 5 minutes of arc. There are some more partile aspects, including the harsh Sun-Saturn-square (and Sun conjunct Juno with just 15 minutes of arc). So who really knows? But it might be a whole different world by then. Exactly that is what I have been thinking, I will have to first undergo some other Solar Returns. For example the one for 2024 (starting dec. 2023) will have a Venus-Uranus-opposition (and a Moon-Saturn-conjunction). Then the one for 2025, so the preceding one before the SR from the above post, well 2025 seems to be a possibly meaningful or interesting year, as this is also when I am going to have pr Sun conjunct n Moon AND pr Moon conjunct n Sun (both exact in april), so I suppose the Solar Return might be telling or meaningful as well. Well that one will have Moon on the DESC (22 Cancer - 24 Cancer) Uranus (24 Taurus) on IC (27 Taurus). And Mars (5 Leo rx, in 7th house) opposing the midpoint of Pluto (00 Aqua ) and Venus (11 Aqua), it`s actually even widely opposite both of course. And Mercury on 6 Sag partile conjunct my natal ASC. Just noting the standout features that jumped out at me, but well so I gotta get through THESE first. Still Uranus seems to be a constant feature in the future, with that Venus-Uranus-opposition (2024), Uranus-IC-conjunction (2025), Moon-Uranus-opposition (2026). Actually it will even feature a bit in 2023 (Uranus conjunct NN in 9th house - no, I am not REALLY moving to Mallorca, don´t you say it! ), trine Mercury on 15 Cap in 5th house - this is the tightest aspect next year, just one minute of orb. and well Mercury rules the chart. So I`d count it among the standout features. Curious that you have a kind of double whammy here, with not only a Cap sun but Saturn on your natal draco sun. Yes. So glad it worked out this way. Now I think of you as having a whole life in theater that's your "home away from home." Expanding the meaning of home." Absolutely yes. I love how it matches your experience, all of this." Yes, me, too. It both confirms the astrology to be valid, but also the astrology giving a closer inspection about what it was REALLY about or going on.
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Post by Ava on Dec 5, 2022 3:53:32 GMT
(Uranus conjunct NN in 9th house - no, I am not REALLY moving to Mallorca, don´t you say it! I get confused about how you date the SRs. The move ("extended visit") to Mallorca is in 2023/2024, when your SR has that asteroid on comp NN.
Maybe you will move away from Mallorca with SR Uranus-IC, later (2023/2024). People get tired of all the luxury, I know.
Just being silly, or correct, we'll see.
Travel plans aside, thank you for bringing that up, how the years may unfold like chapters of a story, one SR leading into another. I have a striking 2024 draco SR: Jupiter is right on the MC in Taurus, the draco SR ASC in Leo is conjunct my natal draco Jupiter and transiting NN will be on my tropical Jupiter. The following year, it's like Jupiter goes into retirement (not doing much).
"Then the one for 2025, so the preceding one before the SR from the above post, well 2025 seems to be a possibly meaningful or interesting year, as this is also when I am going to have pr Sun conjunct n Moon AND pr Moon conjunct n Sun (both exact in april), so I suppose the Solar Return might be telling or meaningful as well."
WOW, that's huge! Who even gets that in their lifetime, and you have it simultaneously?
"Well that one will have Moon on the DESC (22 Cancer - 24 Cancer)"
Hmm, and then the following year it's sun on the DSC.
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Post by lumina on Dec 5, 2022 10:23:43 GMT
"I get confused about how you date the SRs." Sorry, I was quoting the tropical SR in the above posts, not the Draconic ones.
"The move ("extended visit") to Mallorca is in 2023/2024, when your SR has that asteroid on comp NN." Well if P sais "next year", he probably means the next calendar year, not really exactly 12 months from that moment, so it probably would refer to 2023; however obviously it has been just a joke, so it doens`t really matter either way. And well yes, the SR you mentioned has Mallorca on comp NN and his Pluto and opposing my Chiron, so that is interesting. Maybe Mallorca really becomes a symbol for something, who knows?
People get tired of all the luxury, I know." What luxury? Being in Mallorca does not necessarily mean a luxurious life, I think, especially if you really move there and try to make a living. The luxury is mostly for celebrities and rich tourists I guess.
I am not REALLY intending to move to Mallorca however, I was just as much joking as he was, with a serious overtone, that theoretically I could imagine moving somewhere else, does not need to be Mallorca though. A thought experiment for the both of us.
I have a striking 2024 draco SR: Jupiter is right on the MC in Taurus, the draco SR ASC in Leo is conjunct my natal draco Jupiter and transiting NN will be on my tropical Jupiter." Wow, that is definitely a Jupiter-experience! Sounds great to me.
The following year, it's like Jupiter goes into retirement (not doing much)." Maybe you will need a period of rest and recover from all that expansion and recognition of the year before!
>"WOW, that's huge! Who even gets that in their lifetime, and you have it simultaneously?" Yes, even the absolute peak-moments of both aspects, are just a few days apart, even though of course the progressed aspect lasts longer than just the moment of exactness, but I found it curious to have the exact conjunctions so close together.
pr Sun conjunct n Moon: 29th march (also M`s 40th birthday)
pr Moon conjunct n Sun: 12th april
Hmm, and then the following year it's sun on the DSC.
Yes, I noticed that, too, Rather interesting.
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Post by Ava on May 25, 2023 13:01:47 GMT
I don't know why I bump old threads, I just do. July 8th is my draco SR. Venus on the DSC, and it's my draco Juno Return. The transiting draconic sun just entered Taurus, so my draco SR is coming up. Retrospectively, this chart matches certain highlights, problems, fixations of the past year. The usually-worried Virgo moon tells a story in itself and trines the SR sun-Mercury, while squaring natal draco 6H Mercury...so far, major worries have not foreshadowed actual disasters, knock on wood. Chart ruler Venus is in detriment and angular, ruled by Mars in Pisces. I haven't felt like doing much. I do it out of habit, duty, and the ongoing drudgery of being a Capricorn, but it has seemed the major project is learning to meditate effectively. 3H Jupiter conjunct natal 3H Pluto; Duolingo has been my major new hobby. When my kids ask why I'm doing it, I say I'm trying to prevent dementia. My mind does go to The End.
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Post by Ava on May 25, 2023 13:25:21 GMT
Draco SR, 2023 Outer ring is the solar return. Can't say I like Chiron on natal Uranus on natal, beleaguered tropical moon in Pisces. Pluto in the 6th, in natal 1st house That Pluto forms a grand tine with my natal Jupiter and Neptune, though. Maybe that's protective or some kind of buffer. Cancer rising conjunct natal draco moon. SR Gem moon in the 11th looks alright, though. IC and MC rulers, Venus and Mars, are conjunct in Cancer in the 12th house, along with glyph-Lilith (whichever that one is). There's more but I'll just see how the year goes.
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Post by Ava on May 25, 2023 13:47:53 GMT
Hmm, because astro-seek uses mean node, that chart is quite different from a true node solar return.
My true node draco sun @ 25.47 Taurus, so the mean node chart above takes place a full day after true node SR. Oh well.
True node SR takes place June 19th, 3:50 pm.
29 Virgo ASC square Pluto with 8H Mercury as chart ruler; draco Saturn conjunct natal tropical Mercury.
It's close to the summer solstice so possibly a dramatic year.
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Post by lumina on May 25, 2023 15:48:24 GMT
Ava sounds like an intense transformative year for you ahead. Lots of serious thinking and reflecting, too?
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Post by lumina on May 25, 2023 15:51:09 GMT
Mine already started (10th may, pretty recent actually, and close to my recent lunar Return). SR in the outer ring, I sort of found it interesting that my name is on the ASC. I like that. LOL
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Post by Ava on May 26, 2023 12:06:51 GMT
Wow luminaSo yours is also Virgo rising, with chart ruler + MC ruler Mercury in the 8th. Lots going on in that natal 1st/ draco 8th overlay. Sun-Uranus seems the dominant energy. Any thoughts about how that may play out? I love the SR 7H Jupiter on natal Mars; SR Pallas on natal Ceres-Jupiter and SR Venus on natal Pallas. Looks like high energy, drama, intensity (8H sun-Uranus disposited by Mars in the 10th)...crime fighting? Stardom?
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Post by lumina on May 26, 2023 15:23:22 GMT
Ava"o yours is also Virgo rising," Yes, like the tropical Solar Return as well, Virgo - ASC, but with Mercury on 15 Cap (yes your Sun ) in the 5th house, exactly trine Uranus on 15 Taurus in 9th. Sun-Uranus seems the dominant energy. Any thoughts about how that may play out?" I once read that whatever we think Uranus might be doing, it will be something else entirely, as it is just unpredictable. So no clue really, except that it will be surprising? Well M got married, or at least started to date her now husband and became pregnant, when her tropical SR had Sun conjunct Uranus (though for her it was also conjunct Venus and with a bit more orb Mars, - I rarely ever saw any clearer and more easy to interprete SR. lol) Pretty sure Sun-Uranus will come up with something completely different in my case though. And as you said, lots of 1/ 8th overlay, not quite sure how to feel about that, though I once had a SR with the ASC in my natal 8th house and it was cool. Well not really cool, but there were some really nice and surprising events coming up that year. Curiously it was AFTER the year my grandmother died, I would have rather expected it to be applicable to THAT year, but instead this was the year I sort of just moved on with life. I love the SR 7H Jupiter on natal Mars; Yes like that one too. Interestingly the tropical SR has DESC on 10 Pisces, partile conjunct my natal Jupiter, I kind of like when things get re-emphasized like that. Seems to imply some kind of Jupiter-meaning. SR Pallas on natal Ceres-Jupiter and SR Venus on natal Pallas. Yeah, found Pallas pretty interesting. Looks like high energy, drama, intensity (8H sun-Uranus disposited by Mars in the 10th)...crime fighting? Stardom? Haha, I don´t think so, no crime fighting, no Stardom, but who knows? There might be changes.
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