Natal-Draconic aspects chart

[Deleted]

Hi all!
Inspired by Elysia, and realising that I actually know jack all about Draconic charts, I've decided to post my natal-draconic chart (not synastry) to try and understand it and learn from it.



Natal is the inner wheel, Draconic is the outer wheel. Elysia was saying that it's important to look at the harsh aspects as I'll feel them more. So the harsh aspects I do have are:
N. Mars opposite D. Sun
N. Neptune opposite D. Mercury
N. Saturn opposite D. Moon
N. Mars square D. Pluto (oh dear)
N. Saturn square D. Venus
N. Sun square D. Saturn

I'm trying to understand what these aspects mean in terms of soul evolution and how they may play out in my life. From what I read, Draconic charts are a deep hidden part of our personalities, and also indicate where we are headed or where we have come from. I was a bit confused by that description. Feel free to share your natal-draconic charts too, and if you can also state what a couple or some of your aspects mean, and how you think they influence you, then maybe I'll be able to better understand how to go about interpreting my own aspects. If you have any of the same ones I do and know what they mean, feel free to share!

[Ava]

My favorite topic.

I have a more roundabout way of examining this type of chart, I guess. 

I'll be back later with some comments.

[Deleted]

Here's mine (if this works!) 

Two things strike me: 
Several unaspected planets. 
Aquarius plays a strong role. 
Obviously my draconic contains an aqua stellium. 
But also my natal 11th sun and natal moon trine Uranus. 
Also Uranus conjunct North node. 

I'm not sure what that all means but I think it means something. 

Draconic Uranus on natal DSC. 


Sorry I know I'm not talking much about aspects but these things I've mentioned have always been very fascinating to me. 

[Deleted]

Ooh, nice - you did it! Very interested to see what folks have to say about this.
Has anyone ever read somewhere that one can supposedly see the type of "next" incarnation by examining Draconic Pluto? I seem to remember reading something of the sort. Of course, it's pure speculation and no way we'll ever know if we're right (unless someone gets reincarnated & comes back to this thread with past life memories to confirm that they indeed, were born again as a rock star of the future).

P.S. @dopgang, you seem to have almost the entire span of Aqua covered!

[Deleted]

@dopgang, do you feel that your Draconic chart rings more true to you than your natal? And I noticed that you have Natal Saturn opposite your Draconic Venus, whereas mine is square. I still am not sure if I really relate to my Draconic at all. The Leo Ascendant in my D. chart certainly doesn't fit me. Neither does Venus in Leo (even though that's practically in Virgo).

@icequeen, interesting! I wonder where that theory comes from about your D. Pluto indicating your next incarnation, and why would people think Pluto in particular signifies that?

[Ava]

Feb 27, 2017 23:54:45 GMT @icequeen said:

Ooh, nice - you did it! Very interested to see what folks have to say about this.
Has anyone ever read somewhere that one can supposedly see the type of "next" incarnation by examining Draconic Pluto? I seem to remember reading something of the sort. Of course, it's pure speculation and no way we'll ever know if we're right (unless someone gets reincarnated & comes back to this thread with past life memories to confirm that they indeed, were born again as a rock star of the future).

P.S. @dopgang, you seem to have almost the entire span of Aqua covered!

Vajra wrote a lot about draconics and reincarnation and it was mind-blowing. She erased it from LL and I really feel that loss.

I don't know of anyone else who studied it as meticulously and convincingly.

Edit: If someone knows of any online resources, please post them!


 

[Ava]

bonsai,

As you know I was studying your draco-natal chart and ended up more confused than usual. It's always hard for me to put readings together, but especially when the information is elusive to me. I feel like I haven't "cracked the code" on your chart. It seems more complicated than usual.

But here are just some things to consider...

You have a highly angular chart: Venus-ASC, Uranus-IC, Jupiter-DSC, Chiron-MC.

I don't remember seeing another chart where every single angle has a conjunction. So I will just have to cut myself some slack because obviously you are a unique case.

I believe that, since things happen and manifest on the angles, you must be highly receptive to transits, moreso than most people? I wonder if you've had a lot of experiences where everything suddenly and dramatically changed, and it affected you right down to the core. Uranus on your IC, Chiron on the MC. Planets hitting that axis might cause deep inner turbulence, epiphanies, acts of God or fate. What do you think?

Now, as you see, out of your four natal angles, only the IC receives a draconic conjunction.

How significant that it's draconic Mars (ruler of your NN) conjunct tropical IC-Uranus. With my own way of seeing draconic charts, I take that as a cue that Cancer (associated with the IC) and Aquarius (associated with Uranus) will be fused together elsewhere in the chart. Sure enough, we find an 11H Cancer sun in draconic. Moreover, the sun is the draconic chart ruler (draco Leo ASC.) And it opposes natal Mars, ruler of the NN. Hmm! So there is a thematic circle there.

Also: draco Mars conjunct tropical IC-Uranus in Sadge...all that is trine your NN. And people say the draconic chart has a way of magnifying or expanding upon the nodal axis "story." So since your natal NN is trine IC-Uranus, it makes sense that IC-Uranus energy is a key part of your evolution theme. And having an 11H Cancer sun in draconic is one way that gets accomplished. Especially with synastry: your draconic sun may "invite" tropical planets to itself, and you can learn from these people. 

Even though your draconic sun is not conjunct your natal Mercury, planets falling between those might be important. Because your Mercury squares your nodal axis and is your "skipped step." 

And Mercury is critical because:

- It's your chart ruler
- Your SN ruler, Venus, is conjunct your ASC in Virgo (disposited by Mercury)
- Gem moon in natal and draconic; moon-Mercury mutual reception; natal moon conjunct draconic Mercury

I would say this is like the second theme in your natal-draco chart, defined by that natal moon/draco Mercury conjunction. (The first theme is IC-Uranus conjunct draco Mars.) The way these two themes tie in together is simply by virtue of the fact that a lot of this is happening in Cancer, and Cancer squares your nodes. 

So, to evolve, you consider your feelings, and express your feelings. You might have strong feelings about the words themselves and the emotional connotations. I would imagine that you are sensitive to all of this and also particular. Your awareness of your own psychological construction and preferences moves you from Libra, where you get along with everyone, into Aries, where you see your uniqueness and honor it and will even fight for it if you have to. 8H NN, I would guess there may be times where you have really needed to take a strong stand and leave a group. Like unregistering from an astrology forum, striking out on your own. We dragged you back into our circle but you did take that leap into the abyss, away from everyone, when the moment seemed to call for it. Great Aries NN moment.

Now how is it that we got you back? Okay that is theme number three that I am trying to braid in with the other two. This pull into the occult...

8H NN/Pluto in 2H
Draco Libra Pluto square tropical Mars

Depth/Pluto/Scorpio energy is there on both ends of the nodal axis, and probably informs your decisions about what to do, since your tropical Mars feels all of this. It's almost like you have a double nodal axis, that's what is confusing. It's Libra/Aries and also Pluto SN/8H NN. Mars is the common denominator.

And your tropical Mars opposes your draconic sun in Cancer, so there may be an internal struggle about whether to act on feeling (Cancer) or brute force (Cap Mars) or how to fuse them together increasingly over time. 

And it's the same thing again when you see that your tropical Mars is disposited by Sag Saturn, which opposes your draconic moon in Gemini. So again, Cap/Saturn versus Cancer/moon.

What's really confusing is, almost every sign and planet plays into your nodal axis. I mean, I haven't even gotten into everything. Haven't even addressed Neptune/Pisces or the fact that you're a Leo with an 11H draconic sun, which is the opposite energy. I'm an amateur but I've done enough of these charts to be able to say this is probably the trickiest one I've seen. Either that or as time goes by, I'm more inclined to spend more time trying to unravel the whole thing and then knit it back together in a way that makes sense to me. I just can't exactly do it here. 

[Deleted]

Wow Faith! That is some serious quality analysing there. Thank you so much! I'm trying to read it but unfortunately I don't have time to be able to digest it tonight and try and understand it . But I will be reading it more again tomorrow and over the next couple of days trying to see how it all works and then responding. I can agree that I am a walking talking confusion, that's for sure!

[Ava]

Ah, thanks for your effort, bonsai. No pressure, but if anything clicks, please let me know. I still don't know exactly how to read these charts, just looking for structural connections. And looking to learn more about how to make sense of these things, through trial and error.

[Ava]

Here's mine:




So, in tropical (natal), my sun is the chart ruler. My sun is in Capricorn; it's sextile both my 8H Pisces moon and 4H Scorpio NN. Sun in mutual reception with Saturn. So all of this goes into my nodal axis cooking pot. 

Tropical:
12H Saturn is on my far moon/Neptune midpoint
Draconic:
Draco Saturn is conjunct tropical Neptune
Draco moon conjunct tropical Saturn

My tropical sun is square Pluto, ruler of my NN

My draconic Pluto is part of a grand cross; it squares my natal nodes:

20 Taurus/Scorpio nodes
25 Taurus draconic sun
26 Leo draconic Jupiter 
21 Aquarius draconic Pluto

Draconic Pluto in Aquarius disposited by Pisces Uranus which is conjunct my natal 8H Pisces moon. Snaps together.

Now apparently, all of this is fateful and tied in with my husband. I have a 4H NN so that makes sense, doesn't it?

- So, I have a 4H NN, that's the house of the moon. Well my draconic Pluto is tightly conjunct my husband's draconic moon.
- My NN is sextile my sun, connected to my sun. My husband's draconic Pluto is conjunct my sun.
- And my sun is ruled by Saturn. And my draconic Saturn is conjunct my husband's tropical Saturn.
- Also his draconic Pisces Neptune is conjunct my draconic Uranus, conjunct my natal Pisces moon.
- And his draconic Saturn in Aries is conjunct my draco Neptune in Aries. So again with the whole Saturn-Neptune bit.  

His nodes are conjunct mine with less than 5° so much of what is about him is also about me. For instance his draconic ASC is conjunct my NN and his, it's actually right on our composite NN. 

Always more to say and I don't expect anyone to read. I'm just trying to get some documentation down, and get it right. 

PS It's interesting to me that 3 of the 4 corners of my Mystic Rectangle have natal-draco conjunctions; the only corner that stands alone is Pluto's. 

[Deleted]

Oooh! I will post mine in a minute and make all the connections I can with it. Mine is very interesting

[Deleted]

What I find interesting is that my ASC and Mars fall in my natal 8th house, my Sun falls in my natal 11th house and my Moon falls in my natal third house. What a coincidence! 

There are a lot of connections in this synastry. My draconic ASC-Mars is conjunct my natal Moon in my natal 8th, opposite my natal Pluto. My Draconic Virgo Stelllium also sits in a T-Square with my natal Moon-Pluto opposition, as my Draconic Saturn sits on my natal Pluto and opposes my natal moon. So much of this synastry is focused on that Moon-Pluto opposition that it is insane! 

My natal Sun-Mercury-Neptune and IC all fall in my draconic 8th house, my natal Pluto is conjunct my draconic DSC tight, my draconic Venus in Libra completes a grand trine with my Sun-Moon trine natally, my Draconic Jupiter in Scorpio is conjunct my natal Mars-ASC in Scorpio and sits in my natal first house, my natal Jupiter is in my draconic 10th house, and etc. 

There are so many different things I can find. Lots of Pluto connections which I find interesting. 

[Deleted]

Mar 1, 2017 20:04:22 GMT Ava said:

Feb 27, 2017 23:54:45 GMT @icequeen said:

Ooh, nice - you did it! Very interested to see what folks have to say about this.
Has anyone ever read somewhere that one can supposedly see the type of "next" incarnation by examining Draconic Pluto? I seem to remember reading something of the sort. Of course, it's pure speculation and no way we'll ever know if we're right (unless someone gets reincarnated & comes back to this thread with past life memories to confirm that they indeed, were born again as a rock star of the future).

P.S. @dopgang, you seem to have almost the entire span of Aqua covered!

Vajra wrote a lot about draconics and reincarnation and it was mind-blowing. She erased it from LL and I really feel that loss.

I don't know of anyone else who studied it as meticulously and convincingly.

Edit: If someone knows of any online resources, please post them!


 

I'd like to invite Vajra to the forum. I miss her sweet energy. Is that ok with you guys?

[Deleted]

Ava , I hope you don't mind my quoting you. It's just that it makes it easier to reference which paragraphs I'm referring to.

You have a highly angular chart: Venus-ASC, Uranus-IC, Jupiter-DSC, Chiron-MC.

Y@faith ou are damn right about my chart being angular. I’d never considered that until you pointed it out and started reading about angular, succeedent and cadent charts, I have 6 planets (not including chiron, but including Uranus even though it’s on the IC), that’s ridiculously angular. I read that angular houses are the most powerful ones and that they are the “action” houses. What it means for me, I’m still trying to figure out. And I haven’t always been an active person in my life. And I do indeed have something hitting all my angles.

I believe that, since things happen and manifest on the angles, you must be highly receptive to transits, moreso than most people? I wonder if you've had a lot of experiences where everything suddenly and dramatically changed, and it affected you right down to the core. Uranus on your IC, Chiron on the MC. Planets hitting that axis might cause deep inner turbulence, epiphanies, acts of God or fate. What do you think?

To be honest, I don’t know if I’m more receptive to transits than other people. There are transits that have affected others and I went “well, I didn’t feel anything”, but then again I haven’t studied my transits too much in the past. I know that years ago when Uranus transited my Jupiter, I did have a sudden break-up, and Jupiter conjuncts my DC. At that same time as it was conjuncting Jupiter, it would have been opposing my Venus conjunct ASC. But one thing I can say for sure, I’d never felt a transit more powerful than Saturn return. But I think most people feel theirs strongly. I am thinking that Saturn may be a bigger theme for me in the next phase of the Saturn cycle, but I’m not sure.

How significant that it's draconic Mars (ruler of your NN) conjunct tropical IC-Uranus. With my own way of seeing draconic charts, I take that as a cue that Cancer (associated with the IC) and Aquarius (associated with Uranus) will be fused together elsewhere in the chart. Sure enough, we find an 11H Cancer sun in draconic. Moreover, the sun is the draconic chart ruler (draco Leo ASC.) And it opposes natal Mars, ruler of the NN. Hmm! So there is a thematic circle there.

Wow that’s pretty involved. But that is an interesting pick up! The part where you point out that draconic Mars (which rules my natal NN) conjuncts my natal IC-Uranus intrigues me, because when I was studying the transits to my natal chart, around the time when I made the sudden decision to move overseas, transit Uranus was conjunct my natal NN (ruled by mars)! Could it be possible that making the big move overseas was meant to happen? Due to D. Mars conjuncting N. IC and Uranus, where IC is about the home, could that mean that I was meant to make a new home elsewhere? Like Mars and Uranus finally shook hands through my NN to make that happen? And then my Draconic sun opposing natal Mars, I wonder what that could mean in my life.

Also: draco Mars conjunct tropical IC-Uranus in Sadge...all that is trine your NN. And people say the draconic chart has a way of magnifying or expanding upon the nodal axis "story." So since your natal NN is trine IC-Uranus, it makes sense that IC-Uranus energy is a key part of your evolution theme. And having an 11H Cancer sun in draconic is one way that gets accomplished. Especially with synastry: your draconic sun may "invite" tropical planets to itself, and you can learn from these people.

So when you say Draconic sun inviting tropical planets to itself, do you mean I’d be inviting a lot of Cancer-dominant people in my life, seeing as my D. Sun is in Cancer? Or you mean it invites Uranus dominant types of people since it’s in 11th house?

And Mercury is critical because:

- It's your chart ruler
- Your SN ruler, Venus, is conjunct your ASC in Virgo (disposited by Mercury)
- Gem moon in natal and draconic; moon-Mercury mutual reception; natal moon conjunct draconic Mercury

I would say this is like the second theme in your natal-draco chart, defined by that natal moon/draco Mercury conjunction. (The first theme is IC-Uranus conjunct draco Mars.) The way these two themes tie in together is simply by virtue of the fact that a lot of this is happening in Cancer, and Cancer squares your nodes.

So I have Natal Uranian-IC conjunct D. Mars and Natal moon conjunct D. Mercury, and they’re tied together through Cancer. Hmm….

So, to evolve, you consider your feelings, and express your feelings. You might have strong feelings about the words themselves and the emotional connotations. I would imagine that you are sensitive to all of this and also particular.

Oh yes, I do have strong feelings about words and sometimes I can become paralysed trying to find the right word to describe something appropriately.

Your awareness of your own psychological construction and preferences moves you from Libra, where you get along with everyone, into Aries, where you see your uniqueness and honor it and will even fight for it if you have to. 8H NN, I would guess there may be times where you have really needed to take a strong stand and leave a group. Like unregistering from an astrology forum, striking out on your own. We dragged you back into our circle but you did take that leap into the abyss, away from everyone, when the moment seemed to call for it. Great Aries NN moment.

Damn straight! . I do like getting along with people and hate discord, but sometimes it seems I have to strike out on my own.

8H NN/Pluto in 2H
Draco Libra Pluto square tropical Mars

Depth/Pluto/Scorpio energy is there on both ends of the nodal axis, and probably informs your decisions about what to do, since your tropical Mars feels all of this. It's almost like you have a double nodal axis, that's what is confusing. It's Libra/Aries and also Pluto SN/8H NN. Mars is the common denominator.

And your tropical Mars opposes your draconic sun in Cancer, so there may be an internal struggle about whether to act on feeling (Cancer) or brute force (Cap Mars) or how to fuse them together increasingly over time.

And it's the same thing again when you see that your tropical Mars is disposited by Sag Saturn, which opposes your draconic moon in Gemini. So again, Cap/Saturn versus Cancer/moon.

What's really confusing is, almost every sign and planet plays into your nodal axis. I mean, I haven't even gotten into everything. Haven't even addressed Neptune/Pisces or the fact that you're a Leo with an 11H draconic sun, which is the opposite energy. I'm an amateur but I've done enough of these charts to be able to say this is probably the trickiest one I've seen. Either that or as time goes by, I'm more inclined to spend more time trying to unravel the whole thing and then knit it back together in a way that makes sense to me. I just can't exactly do it here.

This is much appreciated Faith. It does look really damn complex, and it might explain why I’m still trying to figure out what the heck’s supposed to happen in my life . But you are right about the part where I am sometimes quite torn between acting on feeling or just going straight in without thinking too much about things (Cap/Saturn). And the part about Pluto SN/8H NN, seeing as Pluto naturally rules 8th house, it’s like both my South and North nodes have the Pluto theme, which is confusing, and not sure how that plays out in my life yet.

Also, what does disposited mean?

[Ava]

@bonsai

Thank you! I'll get back to you soon.🌻

But quickly:

A dispositor is a planet that rules the sign that another planet is located in. It is a synonym for the term "ruler" or "lord".
theastrologydictionary.com/d/dispositor/

@dancingmaenad

I'm sure we'd all love to have Vajra here!!! That would be amazing. Yes please invite her! 

[Deleted]

What do you guys think it would mean if one's draconic was nearly identical to their natal? Same ASC/Moon/Venus/Mars/Mercury/Chiron/Vertex/Outer planets... etc? They only thing different would be the Sun the next sign over? I'd assume this person would be the closest possibly living incarnation of their highest self..

[Deleted]

No problem Faith, and thank you for the explanation .

athena. I've pondered that myself, I have moon and Mercury in the same sign in both Draconic and Natal, but otherwise all my signs are shifted back by one. In order to achieve near identical, it seems you have to have a very early Aries or very late Pisces North node, and if that's the case, does that mean that Aries and Pisces are particularly special signs for the natal North node?

[rietje1]

I'm not really into draconic charts because I don't really know how it plays out, especially with the natal chart. The most I think is just seeing themes in your natal come back into the draconic.

But for aspects:

My draconic Sun is exactly conjunct my natal Venus (and Juno)
d Mars on natal ASC
d Chiron on natal Sun
d ASC on natal Pluto
d Moon on natal NN

The funniest thing is that in the natal, I'm an air void (unless you count angles). Here? 7 air planets.

[Ava]

In my experience, draconic offers a deeper view of synastry.

rietje1

Draco moon in Aquarius, on your NN? That's amazing.

I tend to get along really well with Aqua moons, possibly because my draconic Uranus is conjunct my natal moon. My husband has a draco moon in Aquarius.

Anyway...I love your sun-Venus conjunction, it helps explain your kindness and matches your interests in cosmetology. And this is Virgo, isn't it?