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Post by 12YearsABlob on Jul 10, 2019 0:25:45 GMT
Mercury as chart ruler, conjunct the sun and Mars in the 3H. Mercury rules the MC which is conjunct my natal Gem Mars and draco Mercury. Mercury is conjunct my husband's NN persona Mercury @ 24 Scorpio. No wonder I talk too much. Well, that NN is on my mercury, so.........you can't escape my yapping either.
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Post by lumina on Jul 10, 2019 5:11:18 GMT
I guess you could say that. Tr Pluto is conjunct our c-Moon on 22 Capricorn and squares our c-Mars on 23 Libra Tr Neptune squares our c-Neptune and c-Mercury (15-17 Sag) Tr Saturn conjuncts c-Venus on 16 Cap and has just been squaring c-Pluto on 15 Libra Tr Jupiter conjuncts c-Mercury-Neptune about now and will conjunct c-Sun on 26 Sag in november Tr SN has been conjunct c-Moon (22 Cap) and squaring c-Mars (23 Libra) and c-NN (20 Libra) and is now applying to conjunct c-Venus (16 Cap) and squaring c-Pluto (15 Cap) Did I forget anything? No, I think that`s it.
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Post by lumina on Jul 10, 2019 5:21:08 GMT
btw this is P`s SN persona chart
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Post by Ava on Jul 10, 2019 14:21:54 GMT
And about the SN persona of the Davison with your husband, that Sun-Venus-(Neptune) on IC, sextile Mars - whoa! I suppose you have been together before. I like all the stuff that's right @ 16°, but as usual, it's just my rectified chart. And as usual, I don't really like or believe in Davison...but here, it's just a compelling and orderly image. And to me, structured charts tend to indicate some kind of holistic bond, like it's an actual song, and not just kids banging on instruments. And it does seem like he and I were "fated" to be together, though as for past lives, it's probably something like, we killed each other in a duel, so there was no victor, and maybe God said, "That was poorly done -- not impressed -- so next time, you have to get married. See how you like that!" Or maybe that duel happened many lifetimes ago and we've been recovering bit by bit. So layered on that old memory, there are other memories of times when we did bridge the gap, connect soul to soul, if only partially and in glimmers...like you see something is possible but you haven't built it yet. Like Tesla knowing wireless communication could happen, all the mental constructs had taken shape, and the project had begun, but it didn't actually happen. (Weird analogy, but I do think that higher math is channeled somehow, and it's spiritual, and the realization of love might happen the same way, in epiphanies and revelations...maybe the issue is, can you get that feeling to stick? I have Uranus -- epiphany planet? -- square Saturn. I think my "epiphanies" don't always turn out well in the long run.) "Which describes the other set of a series of dreams I`ve had in younger years, when I was looking for my "twin" and accusing my parents to withhold him or hide him or keep him away from me. I`ve even searched for him in towers, sounds weird, but I remember one particular tower. lol he wasn`t there of course, but it just struck me and reminded me of that dream, when P was posting a picture of exact that tower, which apparently stands in his hometown. lol" This honestly sounds like you met him before and considered him your other half. Children's instincts are so keen and honest like that, it's possible you just knew something and couldn't be fooled. "Ancient Greek, Russian (at the same time, which was a bit stupid, as it means I had to juggle two new alphabets. lol)" That's not stupid, that's admirable. At least you were applying yourself to a challenge, and you didn't have to! "Or many many years ago waking up with that word 'Querida' - and it took me quite a bit time to figure out what it means." I can understand that the mind retains much more than we are able to retrieve, and perhaps in those back rooms of our mind, we are figuring out the meanings of foreign words, via context, and root words, cognates, whatever. Funny story, my daughter came downstairs a few weeks ago and told me all about this dream she had, where the people were speaking a language called "Valerian." I asked her to spell it for me, and that's what she said. Well in our house, we don't use Valerian as an herbal remedy promoting sleep, but I knew that it was used for that....so I was laughing right away and telling her about it. Ha, almost like her mind was saying, "You're stuck in this REM cycle too long, maybe try and find some Valerian, that will help you sleep deeper next time." "Well in his SN I see Cancer-Sun, so a very caring energy, but conjunct Chiron, could just be ver mature of course, but it squares Ceres, so despite the caring attitude there seems to be a tension with nurture/ caring/ children. Ceres, esp. in difficult aspects, can sometimes also be about the feeling of loss, having to let go of something, a child or just something you care about most, or having to share. (Ceres had to share her daughter with Pluto)." Interesting interpretation. And it helps me understand my own Ceres-Atropos conjunction. "And also Ceres was ONLY a mother, while Jupiter fathered their daughter," Oh really? Geez, I need to learn mythology! H's Jupiter is exactly conjunct my Ceres. "Ceres didn`t want him around either" Relatable 😂 But in our case, it's Gemini, so it was complicated. "it sort of reminds me that the Italian Persona actually has a child with a woman he is not living with, so who knows? Maybe that is also described there." WOW -- yes. "Anyway there seems to be a potential for caring but also the potential for experiencing vulnerability and wounded ness around caring or not be allowed to care the way he might want to? or need to?" Yeah, I would say so! "his Vesta on my ASC-Karma makes me think of him being actually pretty dedicated, but possibly not able to really manifest it, mostly cause I wouldn`t let it." Ah, yes. Reminds me a bit of a song lyric: "I guess the distance between us was my love, never had." There's love, but it's not being accepted and acted upon. "Also my SAturn in the SN persona sits on his SN of his SN-persona - not a coincidence that this crossed my path today when transiting Sun-NN is conjuncting it and Tr Saturn opposing it. lol " Oh my gosh, too crazy! "SAturn on the sN can be very binding or restrictive or overly demanding of course. maybe it was not necessariyl a romantic partner, could have been a parental - child relationship too, though Saturn rules my DESC of that chart, so I am not so sure about that." Hmm, it was deep though. Well my natal Saturn is on Elvis' SN, I think he was my Pharoah in a past life. What? Maybe "As for your NN persona chart, you do have a Sun-Moon-aspect as well, a trine! I love that!" *takes a bow* Thank you...it wasn't easy. (Giving birth to five children without any painkillers I mean. Cancer moon trine Scorpio stellium. lol) "And also the ASC-DESC, just see where THAT one falls! Wow! in terms of natal charts I mean. " I know, right? And maybe my birth time is slightly later so that axis is right on our synastric opposition. Whatever the case may be, that axis haunts me. I'm in a musical mood, don't know why.... Oh God, true story, my husband just called from LA to say that he and my daughter are at IHOP and Elvis was playing in the restaurant...he held the phone out so I could hear "The Wonder of You." *throwing in the towel* It's a strange day.
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Post by Ava on Jul 10, 2019 14:44:14 GMT
This made me snort out my drink. Thanks for the keyboard spatter, Ava ! >_< hehehe thanks... ...Given that this axis is about balance, it's probably asking to build that solid foundation without sacrificing the tenderness of the other side. Yes, exactly. Well I meant to say, about the schoolyard planets getting into a long line, that is like following "the rules," a very Capricorn mandate, fitting for your NN and the NN persona stellium there. Capricorn is actually super tender but it's like the 3 Little Pigs, where one needs to build the house of bricks first, get everything totally stable, and THEN the feelings come, the housewarming party and hugs all around...you know.... Sometimes the house never gets built and then the Cap is stuck in a holding pattern. The Mars-Pluto side, with its relentless quest for regeneration and sticking it out through thick and thin, pitted against the Saturn-Chiron chronic issues that refuse to go away. It's quite fascinating, really - both those sides are pulled together by the Sun-Venus on the IC. Those three are keeping the peace, keeping it all together. "It'll all be okay as long as we keep the home fires burning." Wow, such an incisive analysis, and very accurate, thanks. Well, that NN is on my mercury, so.........you can't escape my yapping either. Hope not!
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Post by 12YearsABlob on Jul 10, 2019 15:20:47 GMT
Capricorn is actually super tender but it's like the 3 Little Pigs, where one needs to build the house of bricks first, get everything totally stable, and THEN the feelings come, the housewarming party and hugs all around...you know.... Yeah, totally.. Didn't mean to imply that it wasn't, I was speaking about the axis a whole. In fact, I have something similar in my notes - they were about Cap moon, but I think it applies to this energy in general. Cap moons absolutely *need* commitment before they can relax into the relationship. I know a lot of people with Cap placements, and it could apply to most any planet (including my own Cap/Saturn influence).
There's also the 1st-7th polarity, which I see as somewhat situational. Meaning that Cappy's "Cancer" side (or the qualities traditionally ascribed to Cancer) comes out in one on one (or close) relationships. It needs the 7th house activation (seeing as Cancer is Cappy's solar 7th house). Well, it's just a theory, but you see where I'm going.. It's always there, just a matter of what brings it out, like you said. Wow, such an incisive analysis, and very accurate, thanks. Thank you! The benefits of hindsight make me a better astrologer.. Lol.
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Post by lumina on Jul 10, 2019 19:24:03 GMT
Ava "And as usual, I don't really like or believe in Davison..." Well, my own Persona chart with P doesn`t really speak to me that much. I mean I am sure I could find something valuable in there, but I just don´t "feel" it, if you know what I mean. "but here, it's just a compelling and orderly image." Yes, absolutely. " And to me, structured charts tend to indicate some kind of holistic bond, like it's an actual song, and not just kids banging on instruments." I like that metaphor, yes. " And it does seem like he and I were "fated" to be together, though as for past lives, it's probably something like, we killed each other in a duel, so there was no victor, and maybe God said, "That was poorly done -- not impressed -- so next time, you have to get married. See how you like that!" " Love your hunour. Well no greater battlefield than marriage, right? Nah seriously I find that important to keep in mind that we of course would not always have been lovers, in a past life, if we believe in those, which I do actually. lol But we could have been killing each other, or just simply one selling the other the milk every morning. lol "This honestly sounds like you met him before and considered him your other half. Children's instincts are so keen and honest like that, it's possible you just knew something and couldn't be fooled." I donßt know that, but could be. Also fits the weird sense that my own defense system seem to not think of him as different energy, at least he can slip right under it, and I have a very modern high state of the art emotional/ energetical defense system usually! lol But he is one of the very few people who manage to just sneak up on me without me noticing. It`s confusing actually. " I can understand that the mind retains much more than we are able to retrieve, and perhaps in those back rooms of our mind, we are figuring out the meanings of foreign words, via context, and root words, cognates, whatever. " Yes, I believe that. Well last semester I was supervising the Italian course writing their paper and out of boredom I sstarted reading the text they should work on, of course it was in Italian, I do not really speak one word Italian. However I think my Latin-knowledge helps me somehow understanding many words, and the rest just falls into place, except for 1-2 sentences, but I understood the rest of the paper pretty well. "You're stuck in this REM cycle too long, maybe try and find some Valerian, that will help you sleep deeper next time." LOL That is so great! Funny story, but also mystical. But then again I am sure our brain processes more and knows more than it usually let us know. "Oh really? Geez, I need to learn mythology! H's Jupiter is exactly conjunct my Ceres." Well, I still think that is a wonderful aspect. Also, Jupiter and Ceres were siblings, too (yeah, the old incest stories aobut the gods. lol but Juno was his sister as well), and they got along pretty well, Ceres was just not so much interested in having a romantic relationship with him, and he wasn`t really that way inclined towards her, but there was no bad blood either. Even Juno accepted that they had a child together, which is pretty unusual for vengeful raging with jealousy and punishing the women/ girls and their offspring for her husband`s misbehaviours. But apart from mythology, Jupiter is expansive, and with Ceres there is a very caring vibe. The only problem is Ceres can become too consumed with caring and nurturing and there is also that fear of loss, because she is so focused on her daughter (or in more general terms we can become too focused on what we love most, that this love becomes mixed with fear of loss) "Oh God, true story, my husband just called from LA to say that he and my daughter are at IHOP and Elvis was playing in the restaurant...he held the phone out so I could hear "The Wonder of You." " Love that story! And that your husband would call you to tell you, too! As for P and me I find it interesting that in our SN Persona synastry there is his Sun conjunct my Moon, being squared to my Personal nodal axis. But even more than this, how his SN Persona Venus on 12 Aries conjuncts my SN Persona Mars on 8 Aries, and his wife`s SN Persona Mrs is on 8 or 9 Libra opposing this (and conjunct my Pluto). his SN Persona Venus and my SN Persona Mars are also near his SN Persona DESC. In our NN Persona chart it is the other way round: my NN Persona Venus: 25 Libra his NN Persona Mars: 26 Libra his NN Persona ASC: 29 Libra
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Post by Ava on Jul 10, 2019 22:53:33 GMT
12YearsABlob"Yeah, totally.. Didn't mean to imply that it wasn't," I didn't meant to imply that you implied that..I know you know, so I said "you know." (What's funny with that sentence is ^ I'm sincere and hoping it makes sense.) Sorry, though, I just sorta reflexively hop on my soapbox and give the "Caps have feelings too!" PSA, whenever there's an excuse. "There's also the 1st-7th polarity, which I see as somewhat situational. Meaning that Cappy's "Cancer" side (or the qualities traditionally ascribed to Cancer) comes out in one on one (or close) relationships. It needs the 7th house activation (seeing as Cancer is Cappy's solar 7th house). " Well said. Cap isn't really its whole self without Cancer energy. I mean a Cap may be striving for something but without sharp emotional reflexes, intuition and spirituality, a Cap is going nowhere, no matter how much money they make. And for Cancer, it's the same...they might be onto everyone's feelings like white on rice, but if they aren't using that information constructively, they can bring people down. There's just that overall need for male/female, moon/Saturn archetypal balancing.
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Post by Ava on Jul 11, 2019 0:18:18 GMT
lumina "Well, my own Persona chart with P doesn`t really speak to me that much. I mean I am sure I could find something valuable in there, but I just don´t "feel" it, if you know what I mean." That's exactly how I usually am with Davison. "But we could have been killing each other, or just simply one selling the other the milk every morning. lol" LOL, yeah, kinda like the Wizard of Oz, everyone turns into someone else. Or like dreaming, I guess. Though I have no idea why we would be confined to this species and this planet. And if animals reincarnate, what do they do once their species goes extinct? I guess I should read up on the topic sometime. "Also fits the weird sense that my own defense system seem to not think of him as different energy, at least he can slip right under it, and I have a very modern high state of the art emotional/ energetical defense system usually! lol But he is one of the very few people who manage to just sneak up on me without me noticing. It`s confusing actually." I remember you saying this before and it's just no wonder you are still so keenly aware of him after all this time. I mean if he can enter your zone undetected even if he is physically present, because your walls are down when it comes to him, it seems he would be free to come and go as he pleases on the etheric level. "it was in Italian, I do not really speak one word Italian. However I think my Latin-knowledge helps me somehow understanding many words, and the rest just falls into place, except for 1-2 sentences, but I understood the rest of the paper pretty well." Amazing! "Well, I still think that is a wonderful aspect. Also, Jupiter and Ceres were siblings, too" ROFL, yeah I can never condone all the incest in our solar system, no wonder there is entropy. But seriously I think it's funny that H has Proserpina @ 2 Gem conjunct his Jupiter and my Ceres @ 1 Gem. My son's sun is conjunct that @ 29 Taurus. Opposing that, I have Persephone @ 29 Scorpio conjunct my daughter's sun (oh, and it would be Scorpio/Hades...but she's a good sport about being a Scorpio). And back to that Gemini theme, it's not like our daughters are twins, but they both have blonde curly hair, which is fairly uncommon and distinctive, and there is that similarity with their names that I may have mentioned. If not: guess what, there is a similarity with their names. "The only problem is Ceres can become too consumed with caring and nurturing and there is also that fear of loss, because she is so focused on her daughter (or in more general terms we can become too focused on what we love most, that this love becomes mixed with fear of loss)." Yeah, makes sense. I just paused for a somber moment considering H's Ceres is exactly conjunct my mother's sun, which probably makes his form of caring all the more familiar to me, but that is pretty far out, right? Oh and that's conjunct my draconic Jupiter. (And His Zeus is tightly conjunct my sun, opposing my Cora, but who's counting these things? WHY count these things? lol) Anyway, now I'm looking at Ceres persona charts. His Ceres persona is virtually identical to my Leo friend's chart, it's just one day off. And that's where my tertiary progressions are headed very soon. On my birthday next year. My Ceres persona is nice, it's got the Gem sun conjunct Venus-Mercury in late Taurus; 24 Taurus Venus sextile 22 Pisces moon. "And that your husband would call you to tell you, too!" Well he's also Gemini Ceres, and his Ceres persona chart has the sun on the ASC. His Ceres Persona Venus is @ 22 Taurus, conjunct mine. I think our philosophies on child-rearing definitely could have been better aligned from the start, but we did agree on aesthetics. Like I've said before elsewhere, he was so adamant that everyone had to have a bear costume and bear ears on their hoods whenever possible. LOL, that is so Taurus, I think. Dressing one's children as cubs, so they legit have fur. "As for P and me I find it interesting that in our SN Persona synastry there is his Sun conjunct my Moon, being squared to my Personal nodal axis." That is pretty huge. Well I like all the persona synastry, just wasn't sure if that was "allowed," but if you do it, I consider it allowed.
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Post by lumina on Jul 11, 2019 5:57:37 GMT
Ava"hat's exactly how I usually am with Davison. " I guess I am just not really agreeing with the theory behind it. I prefer the composite by far as it describes actual interrelations between the charts. Actually I just left a fb group Paul Westran has for that reason. Not that I even explained my reasons, it isn`t that active either. lol Just really got fed up with the sort of selfentitlement I perceived. Don`t get me wrong, he did a wonderful research study on progressed synastry which restored my faith in astrology to a large amount. But the constant "there are no experts on composites" and so on just got on my nerves. Who decides there aren`t? he? On what qualification or basis? And just because composites have not been around for thousands of years, the research being done is meaningless? Excuse me? There were two options: Argue or leave. I chose the latter, cause I didn`t care enough about that to be honest. But the Davison? I just don`t know. "t seems he would be free to come and go as he pleases on the etheric level. " Partially. Unless one of us is blocking it. "But seriously I think it's funny that H has Proserpina @ 2 Gem conjunct his Jupiter and my Ceres @ 1 Gem. My son's sun is conjunct that @ 29 Taurus. Opposing that, I have Persephone @ 29 Scorpio conjunct my daughter's sun (oh, and it would be Scorpio/Hades...but she's a good sport about being a Scorpio). " Wow! quite an alignment. BTW Ceres I do think that Ceres is wonderful in synastry, because of her caring nature, and of course she also has connections to the environment, being an earth goddess and about harvest and so on. Just sometimes she might care "too much" and getting so obsessed with something that she neglects anything else (when she was searching for her daughter, she completely neglected her job providing nutrition for the earth and all humanity, too, leading to great famine and eternal winter on earth and so on) "My Ceres persona is nice, it's got the Gem sun conjunct Venus-Mercury in late Taurus; 24 Taurus Venus sextile 22 Pisces moon. " that is nice. P and me have both, individually Moon on the ASC in the Ceres-persona chart, though his is exact on 22 Leo, mine comes with an orb, with ASC on 15 Libra, Moon on 19 Libra. My Ceres Persona also has Chiron conjunct Juno on 21 Aries, and Venus on 6 Aries opposing Pluto on 8 Libra, so a rather intense Persona chart, not quite easy. Well Venus is the chartruler, on 7 Aries and actually conjunct Ceres herself on 4 Aries. My Ceres Persona Moon also conjuncts P`s Ceres Persona Pluto (and his natal Pluto) on 20 and 21 Libra, and my Persona Chiron-Juno opposes it. his Ceres Persona chart has Moon and ASC in Leo as I said, so the chartruler is Sun on 7 Aries. Of course this is his natal Ceres-position. Well his own Ceres Persona is not un-intense either. Venus on 22 Taurus Uranus on 25 Scorpio Moon-ASC on 22 Leo Mars on 26 Leo NN on 28 Leo there are some easy aspects to that, too, like Moon-ASC trines Neptune on 22 Sag in 5th house and Venus on 22 Taurus trines Saturn on 22 Virgo with just one minute. There is Also a yod to Venus of Pluto on 20 Libra, Neptune on 22 Sag, to Venus on 22 Taurus Anyway we have intense Ceres-synastry anyway, but also his Ceres conjuncts his wife`s and youngest son´s Sun. Well actually there is a Yod in my Ceres persona chart, too of Neptune on 11 Sag, Mercury on 13 Aqua to Saturn on 12 Cancer near the MC. of course a much mroe sober picture. Funny enough my Ceres Persona Jupiter is on 25 pisces (on his natal ASC and near our composite Ceres) and trines his Ceres Persona Uranus on 25 Scorpio exact. Plus his Moon trines my Chiron-Juno from 22 Leo to 21 Aries. and his Neptune on 22 Sag of course makes this a Grand trine. Hmm, a Kite, as his Ceres Persona Pluto is on 20 libra and my Ceres Persona Moon is on 19 Libra. lol " Dressing one's children as cubs, so they legit have fur. " LOl Yes "Well I like all the persona synastry, just wasn't sure if that was "allowed," but if you do it, I consider it allowed. " Of course. It is just like usual synastry, we only have to keep in mind it is only elaborating on a certain planetary energy. So whatever synastry in your Ceres-persona charts comes up, it is only related to Ceres symbolism, about the nurturing/ Caring principle.
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Post by FruityLlama on Jul 11, 2019 10:41:27 GMT
How cool! Would anyone mind if I post my charts too?
I don't know if this is interesting but my SN chart gives me a 5* Taurus sun, whilst my NN chart gives me a 5* Scorpio sun. This straddles my natal NN axis exactly..!!
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Post by Ava on Jul 11, 2019 11:27:27 GMT
How cool! Would anyone mind if I post my charts too? I don't know if this is interesting but my SN chart gives me a 5* Taurus sun, whilst my NN chart gives me a 5* Scorpio sun. This straddles my natal NN axis exactly..!! Yes, of course, all charts welcome! Persona charts show the sun's transit to your planets and points in the year after you were born. So, the moment the transiting sun was exactly conjunct your natal SN -->> that is your SN persona chart. And the moment the sun transited your NN, that is the NN persona chart.
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Post by FruityLlama on Jul 11, 2019 12:29:21 GMT
Oh! Yes that makes sense now, I was also going to ask why the chart was configured for 1996 after I was born. Gosh sorry, monumentally dumb moment there!! Thanks Ava here are my charts: SN chart: NN Chart: I don't know if my natal chart is needed to compare. I will add it so I can at least look at everything together:
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Post by FruityLlama on Jul 11, 2019 12:34:21 GMT
Apologies for all the extra asteroids in the persona charts- hope you don't mind. What first came to mind when looking at mine was the difference in where the planets are scattered. In my SN chart, everything is spread out like a splash chart whereas my NN chart is a lot more concentrated in the upper hemispheres. My natal is like a little love child between the two, mirroring the (almost, not quite) cradle in the NN chart, whilst maintaining a bit of a splash look similar to the SN chart. Guess that makes sense really if we are a culmination of where we have been and what we are trying to achieve.
I couldn't tell you for love nor money what the lessons are in these charts are supposed to be though! Unless it is just about honing any skills or crafts I started in a past life, perhaps I was a jack of all trades and now I need to focus on marrying them together.
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Post by FruityLlama on Jul 11, 2019 13:36:34 GMT
By the way, what say you all to Draconic SN persona charts???
Actually just realised I don't know how to do those, it just gives me the same persona chart even when I click on draconic.
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Post by Ava on Jul 11, 2019 14:35:41 GMT
Hi lumina"I guess I am just not really agreeing with the theory behind it." Same. Well Davison...I'm always struggling to find the words for the problem, and feeling like real astrologers ought to have done this work for me, before I came along. It exalts the sun-sun midpoint while erasing the significance of the other midpoints. I can appreciate that there is a linear timeline, and there is a symbolic significance to that timeline, but to me, astrology is more geometrical and three-dimensional...it's a chronology of shapes, tilted orbital planes, and planetary alignments, against a backdrop of days and nights. The days and nights are like the metronome and the transits are the music. I'm on a roll with metaphors lately. If you can believe it, I've gone through phases where I am even worse than this, lol. Anyway, Davison is just looking at that metronome. "This is the middle of the song, right on this beat here." Okay, great, maybe the middle is significant? Halfway through that span of time, something happened. But, as with a regular song, why should that halfway point matter? Just because it's middle time doesn't mean it automatically reflects the middle ground. I mean maybe there is no such thing as THE middle ground, not in totality, as Davison charts suggest. The composite is an array of midpoints and a mapping of dynamics, considerate to the fact that each individual retains their original "music." So it's more like two songs being played simultaneously from two different stereos, and you notice harmonies and discord as they overlap. "But the constant 'there are no experts on composites' and so on just got on my nerves. Who decides there aren`t? he? On what qualification or basis? And just because composites have not been around for thousands of years, the research being done is meaningless? Excuse me?" Right. Well as I see it, they uphold certain "values," as they preserve order & proportions. "(when she was searching for her daughter, she completely neglected her job providing nutrition for the earth and all humanity, too, leading to great famine and eternal winter on earth and so on)" Ha, it's always a woman's fault. I mean this level of screwing things up for all existence reminds me of Eve. "P and me have both, individually Moon on the ASC in the Ceres-persona chart, though his is exact on 22 Leo, mine comes with an orb, with ASC on 15 Libra, Moon on 19 Libra." How beautiful! I was reading the Ceres-persona synastry with interest, but I don't know enough about how these "feel" or work to really comment meaningfully. I am also in the mood to fall into speculation too much, as Ceres has a kind of allure or feeling that all will be well.
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Post by Ava on Jul 11, 2019 16:15:07 GMT
I couldn't tell you for love nor money what the lessons are in these charts are supposed to be though! Unless it is just about honing any skills or crafts I started in a past life, perhaps I was a jack of all trades and now I need to focus on marrying them together. That kind of makes sense (I mean "kind of" just because it's a past life, and I have no idea of how these things work, it's all speculation for me at this point). The SN persona has a sun-moon-Uranus t-square, and the NN sun converts that to a grand cross. You know how folks say, if you have a t-square, you ought to work to embody the energy of the sign that is missing, in the complete modality set? Taurus sun, Leo moon, Aqua Uranus...Scorpio energy is missing there, and conventional astro wisdom says, if you can summon up the power of that missing leg, you can stabilize the t-square and utilize all its energy better. So that's what came to mind for me, that your SN persona presents this frazzled luminary energy, a frenetic and slightly crisis-prone mentality, but by getting to the bottom of the issues at hand (capitalizing on moon opp Aqua Uranus flashes of insight, also pulling from the Mercury-Pluto opposition), you become more powerful >> knowledge is power. NN persona Scorpio sun in the 10th house, exactly sextile the Cap ASC, echoed with a Cap moon. NN persona Mercury conjunct the NN in Libra, seems to show that you are not going anywhere without thinking about it first. And relationships will be important for you with that Libra node conjunct Ceres. Cap moon-Neptune squaring the nodes........ I'm really not good with understanding Cap outer planets, so I will put the question to you, what do you make of that?
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Post by FruityLlama on Jul 11, 2019 19:15:14 GMT
Goodness, thank you so much for that Ava ! I'm constantly in awe of your detailed and eloquent analysis of astrological data! The NN resonates a lot, I hold onto what I know very much- typical earth energy I suppose. That doesn't mean I am stubborn, but as you say, knowledge is power! And enables me to move forward. Interesting about the T-square, I'm just looking back at it. So Scorpio is definitely something I need to indulge in to stabalise this T-square. My natal NN does provide this missing link and would overlay itself onto my Persona 3rd house; siblings, short travels, neighbours, communication. Hmm.... perhaps I should take up poetry again! With regards to Cap outer planets, I only have my natal Neptune to speak of here. Opposing my ASC, I believe it gives me the ability to move in and out of the real world with ease. Neptune is neptune obviously but in a Cardinal sign, plus a very practical and sensible sign such as Capricorn help me create boundaries needed when I'm indulging in neptunian day dreams and fantasies. To put it bluntly, I dream (neptune) of a partner (7th) with whom I can build a little world, that being in the real world. Maybe it would even be a miniature empire, preferably through family, children etc (Capricorn/Cancer axis). I think Capricorn is a good sign to have in the outer planets. In theory it helps create a realistic vision for whatever the planet represents, however I am not so sure that always applies to reality. My generation is full of morons, no offence to anyone, but I am agog at the state we are in. That might be some Cap energy seeping through there too actually- critical of the times (outer planets) we live in! Capricorn in Neptune may make its generation feel as though fantasies can never become a reality, or we become painfully aware of the hard work needed to reach neptunian heights, and the realities of these dreams. More people than ever fantasise about becoming famous, and to do that people are using all measure of platforms to promote themselves as beauty queens or whatever, but "real life" ones. People blogging about their self care routines help to make themselves seem more authentic- this makes me think of trying to marry together the untouchable glamour of fame with being "relatable". I hope that makes sense...that was a bit of a rant, sorry. I'm not even that sure as to whether Capricorn is bothered about being relatable as such, but I am trying to hone in on the realistic, earthy quality it does have...do you know what I mean? I think the moon-nep sq. NN in the persona chart perhaps gives way to a loner quality and perhaps a bit of confusion regarding life in general. I'm good at structuring my life, but I don't know about any spiritual meaning or what my "purpose" is lets say. Not sure most people do to be fair. I get lost in my imagination but it take me a while to get to the conclusion of a certain thought.... as you probably guessed reading my writing haha!!
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Post by Ava on Jul 12, 2019 3:18:05 GMT
FruityLlama , I actually love that "rant" on Cap Neptune -- makes perfect sense!! "More people than ever fantasise about becoming famous," Almost like YouTube was designed just for the Cap Neptune crowd. "I'm good at structuring my life, but I don't know about any spiritual meaning or what my "purpose" is lets say. Not sure most people do to be fair." Yes I think the more a person tries to find meaning, and succeeds, the more difficult some of the conventions of regular success can be. The value systems of capitalism and spirituality are askew, so everyone has to figure out what to do with that, if they aspire to evolution in both areas. "I get lost in my imagination but it take me a while to get to the conclusion of a certain thought.... as you probably guessed reading my writing haha!!" It's actually a really interesting detour and can be such a positive force for change, if you are always checking in with your imagination/desires as you advance. Sure, there's a chance of getting caught up there on the "skipped step." But there's something to be said for contemplation, painting within one's mind. "To put it bluntly, I dream (neptune) of a partner (7th) with whom I can build a little world, that being in the real world. Maybe it would even be a miniature empire, preferably through family, children etc (Capricorn/Cancer axis)." See, I think that's great ~ obviously the more clearly you can envision your destination, the more likely you are to reach it. ("Knowledge is power" theme again.) In contrast, my NN persona has the NN conjunct Uranus, and as I may have said here already, I tended to make life-changing decisions rapidly and in heightened moods, like quantum leaps. It is what it is, it brought what it brought for good and ill, but I wish I had more of that visionary capacity, over the long haul. Well I have NN persona Juno-NN-Uranus and raced to the altar...still can't believe I did that...but that changed everything. You're fortunate to have that more measured-approach Mercury-NN in Libra!
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Post by FruityLlama on Jul 13, 2019 11:53:02 GMT
Ava haha thank you! Yes, I didn't think of economic structures actually- that's a very good point. I do also see amongst people my age a certain fantasist quality when thinking about the structures of society and the world. Look at how popular communism and socialism are becoming in the west... this is worrying, and capitalism is not without faults but I think Neptune readily puts the rose tinted glasses on simply whatever is the alternative, regardless of the details sometimes. Perhaps not a good placement for those kinds of structures, actually. I like what you said though:- "Yes I think the more a person tries to find meaning, and succeeds, the more difficult some of the conventions of regular success can be. The value systems of capitalism and spirituality are askew, so everyone has to figure out what to do with that, if they aspire to evolution in both areas". I couldn't agree more, particularly with the first line. We are competing with each other even more these days, so the stakes are higher and no one feels that more than new graduates like myself :/ "It's actually a really interesting detour and can be such a positive force for change, if you are always checking in with your imagination/desires as you advance. Sure, there's a chance of getting caught up there on the "skipped step." But there's something to be said for contemplation, painting within one's mind". That's lovely, painting within one's mind! That is probably a very good analogy for square relationships- skipped steps probably do need the native to sit back and contemplate in order to integrate the energies. Using different tools together to create a final piece of...something!! Wow that's interesting about your persona chart- it really does spell things out doesn't it! Well, I do think about how things will pan out but sometimes, I don't know, maybe I overthink too much which stops me from just doing things..yknow? I guess I wish I had more spontaneity like you to a certain extent!! Sorry for the detour but I was just looking at my partner's chart on the basis of the topic of relationships. His SN chart shows Sun conj. Juno, a T-square, including Saturn in 2nd opposing Mars in 8th squared by Neptune in 5th. His relationship with money is strained although he is good at organising his finances. He does however find it hard not to be tempted in indulging in his passions- food and wine though. In his NN chart, the sun conjuncts NN in 7th and Venus conjuncts Uranus in the 8th...Neptune right on top of his MC as well...explains a lot about his current career issues. Not sure what to think about the Venus-Uranus in 8th though. His NN Juno conjuncts my natal DSC though. These charts are cool but weird!
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