Feeling unpopular/not liked/unwelcome in the Natal Chart

[rietje1]

Hi everyone,

I want to share my video on things in the natal chart that may make you feel unwelcome, not liked or unpopular (and such) by other people. Quite a few threads from Lindaland actually inspired me to take notes back then.

I even have found more notes for a new video with some extra thoughts on it.  

[Violets]

I have Saturn in my 11th house natally, it’s a tough one for fitting in with groups. I also have Uranus opposite my MC in my natal, lol. I can be quirky and awkward in groups, but apparently still likable enough.

[Ava]

rietje1

I've always valued your insights and just the other day was flipping through an old journal and found a quote of yours!

There's an audio issue here, are you aware of it?

I'm listening in pieces.

My natal Scorpio NN falls in the 11th house of my solar return and I'm finding this difficult. You know, the square energy...Scorpio in the house of Aquarius.

Anyway...more to watch later.

[Deleted]

I can relate to this! While I wouldn't say that I'm "unpopular" necessarily, I've found group dynamics to be the bane of my existence throughout my life. Only recently did I realize it's because my SN is in the 11th, so it seems that whenever I indulge in such a dynamic, it's like I'm karmically undermining my destiny or something.

Mystic Medusa has this to say about NN in the 5th/SN in the 11th - North Node House V
They have an innate urge to be social and join the community or be politically active
but whenever they do, it backfires in weird ways. The true lucky vibe here is for the
person to establish their own scene rather than seeking to belong in one that
already exists.

[Violets]

Hey good insight, athena! I also have my SN on the cusp of my 10th/11th houses, and MM’s description fits perfectly, haha. Spot on.

Edit—I just took a closer look, and my SN is actually in my 10th, NN in my 4th. Maybe my birth time is off by a few minutes, who knows...

[rietje1]

Ava

Ohh wait I should check if this is an issue for headphones. It worked okay on my laptop. Hope you can hear some of it. I also sadly live in a very, very noisy, crowded street and even with everything shut down, it could still be heard.

[rietje1]

I am just really happy with these comments. I always loved talking to you guys on the boards. And athena , I don't think we talked a lot on there? Just knew of each other. Hi!

So, Violets , ohhh would Uranus have something to do with it? I have it opposite my MC as well. I guess my life at home was a bit different. Definitely different from how people would know me.

athena , wow, seconded, completely forgot about that 11th house SN. I have it too and that Mystic Medusa bit pretty much sums up how I felt growing up with groups. Internet boards/communities were easier to fit in with, but even there some of them were horrible!

[Ava]

May 7, 2019 16:01:24 GMT rietje1 said:

Ava

Ohh wait I should check if this is an issue for headphones. It worked okay on my laptop. Hope you can hear some of it. I also sadly live in a very, very noisy, crowded street and even with everything shut down, it could still be heard.

Ah, sorry, I don't mean to complain, I just thought you might want to see if there's an issue...it still has a sort of shrill background buzz, when I remove the headphones. Other videos don't have it. 

Is the audio okay for others?

---

I wanted to say, you mention Venus square ASC as an aspect that could make a person feel unattractive. I have the trine, but it feels more like the square in that respect. It's never done me any good, not when it comes to confidence about my appearance. 

I guess it might have contributed a sense of fun (Leo ASC) and adventure (Sag Venus), which is a whole other kind of beauty, if you are simply open-hearted and up for adventure, and approaching life from that angle.....some people will go along with that, including people who turn out to be romantic interests. 

I'm just thinking, there are probably a lot of people with ASC square Venus who are technically or objectively to most people much better looking than people with the trine. But the people with the square might approach their looks from a sense of crisis and self-consciousness or even fear, while the trine people might feel like it's no big deal.

astro-charts.com/persons/aspect/Ascendant-Square-Venus/

Something I noticed with a few of these female standouts: they are interested in social activism. Maybe in their consciousness of aging and fading beauty they realized they'd have to compensate by trying harder to be beautiful on the soul level? 

- Kim Kardashian: cries about her body every day she says, is becoming a lawyer focused on prison reform
- Brigitte Bardot: says she was "very beautiful but very unhappy" and is devoting her old age to animals
- Alicia Silverstone: vegan activist

Then there are others who've gone through depression and their story is like, "Beauty and fame don't cure everything" (Brooke Shields, Alanis Morisette.)

Overall I think it's an interesting energy. Squares that have been mastered seem more a "force" to be reckoned with, as they are conscious and disciplined.

---

Trying to get a pulse on ASC trine Venus:

astro-charts.com/persons/aspect/Ascendant-Trine-Venus/page/2/

Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, (Jeff Bezos has a wide sextile)...ha, these guys are a different kind of force and consciousness....

Well I'm on my way out and it's hard to say what generalizations can be made; it's off topic anyway. 

[rietje1]

Oh, no, don't worry. You may not be the only one who listened to this with headphones on. So I heard it too, it's less in the Venus-Jupiter thread and very soft without the headphones. I... gotta admit I have no clue what it could be. I use windows camera and while with the first videos, I had to convert them first, now I can upload it straight to Youtube. So I just saw that I can tone down the volume in a video (it was on full ) through an editing program and it at least makes the buzzing less obvious. Would that help?

So the Venus thing surprised me. Granted, I haven't paid as much attention to Venus-ASC aspects yet, but it's a good point. Are you sure it's not a hard aspect to your Venus? I can see a few things possible:

- Said hard aspect to Venus affecting it.

- Like you said, the beauty being more in attitude/spirit - Leo and Sagittarius can both show such a zest for life that it energizes other people. Maybe you're one of those lucky lucky gals who looks gorgeous without much effort. The trine has things come with ease. Or the more natural look suits you a lot. Sagittarius can be that amazon type you know? Dressed/dolled up a bit more minimal so they're ready for a trip for the day.

- Hmm I love the examples of famous women. Maybe it's the Libra side of Venus coming out? Libra's all about justice and so it could lead to putting your efforts into getting justice for someone else/something else. Expressing their femininity by being this power woman for others. Though I wouldn't give up on looks if you don't want to obviously

- I see some really good skin in the pictures on that astro-charts site you linked. The men and the women. The majority at least.

- And yes I agree that with a square, someone would be more focused on it. Not to say that trines/sextiles are lazy or anything, but maybe squares realize more easily just how much of a problem said square is for them.

Ohhh and don't forget where you have your chart ruler! It sounds kind of harsh, but they're known to be extra harsh on themselves, and have these expectations of themselves.

That's what comes to mind right now. Any of these resonate?

[rietje1]

May 7, 2019 14:05:37 GMT Violets said:

Hey good insight, athena ! I also have my SN on the cusp of my 10th/11th houses, and MM’s description fits perfectly, haha. Spot on.

Edit—I just took a closer look, and my SN is actually in my 10th, NN in my 4th. Maybe my birth time is off by a few minutes, who knows...

Hey, if it's really close to the cusp, you can count it as being in both, in my opinion. Don't some chart calculators also automatically put a planet in the next house if it's within X degrees of the next cusp?

[rietje1]

Made a follow-up video on it, with some more stuff about the 11th house, Saturn & outer planets' effect, etc.

I really debated in whether I would make a new thread on it or post it here, but decided to go here in case it feels like spamming the boards.

Audio buzzing is hopefully a lot less loud now!

[Ava]

Thanks rietje1

- You have a point, I suppose there is a remote chance I am Virgo rising, but that really wouldn't fit with any birth stories I was told about myself, nor does it match my hair which I think is very consistent with other Leo risers (thick, obvious mane). And I like the way my rectified chart works. However I've gone through pr ASC square natal Venus for sure, and that could have dealt a blow. Especially since I have my Saturn/Pluto midpoint in Virgo, squaring my Venus.....oh, that's probably it, actually! Maybe pr ASC there brought on some negative experiences that shaped my attitudes.

- It's true the more natural look seems to suit me, I can't get away with much when it comes to accessories, before it seems like I'm trying to be someone I'm not.

- Great catch, I didn't realize the examples I posted were all of Libra women! So no wonder they're attractive, basically.

- True, if my sun's in the 6th, I am more flaw-conscious, almost like a Virgo, but Virgos are naturally good looking and I think 6H suns don't necessarily enjoy the same advantage.

Yes, thanks, it all resonated, gave me some food for thought. I've been running around but will get back to watching your videos soon and post again.

Thanks

[Deleted]

Ava it can be your pisces moon. I dont know how your neptune is aspecting but that's another pointer to look at.

[Ava]

May 11, 2019 1:40:00 GMT @theunknown said:

Ava it can be your pisces moon. I dont know how your neptune is aspecting but that's another pointer to look at.

Pisces moon is apex of t-square with Neptune and Mars.

edit ~

[Ava]

rietje1

I agree with you that even positive Venus-Saturn contacts can be heavy or manifest as a self-image that tends towards the negative. Sometimes there can be an imbalance in relationships where the Venus-Saturn person feels they are more invested and reliable than the other person, and then their minds go to work trying to figure out the reason. That could turn self-incriminating.

Or Venus-Saturn might have such a tangible idea of what a harmonious relationship ought to be like that they remove themselves from one situation after another, because it clashes with their ideal. That might not be a conscious process, but it's like their standards limit their inner circle.

Overall, though, I think people with positive Venus-Saturn aspects are fortunate. I like my trine. Saturn can feel "permissive" when it's positively aspected....Saturn has the other planet's back and so a person can feel sure-footed when the other planet wants to express itself in a more amplified or prominent way.

I marvel at my Sag Venus and its impulses but generally don't regret that I was too outgoing, too wild, said something that could be taken the wrong way. My best friend also has Venus trine Saturn. Recently we went to a concert, and she sat next to a guy who was really friendly and had us laughing. She said, "I'm going home with YOU tonight!!" just as a joke. But I think that's a reflection of Venus-Saturn confidence, that it even occurred to her to say that.

I guess my point is that positive Venus-Saturn contacts can make a person feel secure in their own company, so they wouldn't be as sensitive to feeling unpopular, as it might just feel like a natural process (perhaps this group simply isn't right for them) and not necessarily their own fault.


Pls don't quote, still thinking this through.

[Deleted]

Ava I always see Neptune as striving for that unreachable ideal. Piscean insecurity is very different from cancerean type. But also Pisces is the last sign, it’s about the total package. I know ppl use confusion a lot to describe pisces but I think y’all know what you want, unrealistically at time of course. Libra might want everything to sing and harmonize at the same moment for a total show, Pisces wants things to be a complete show without the showiness, everything has to weave in seamlessly such that the story oozes like water and ppl intuitively get “it” right away. So virtually every Pisces placement is a little bit insecure. Also Neptune square .... Neptune can be violent.

[Ava]

@theunknown,

Love these insights, though I don't see Neptune as violent, but possibly a distorting factor and one ingredient in the inner swamp that leads to violence...or it can be an absence of restraint. I think Pisces can be a codependent sign (symbol is TWO fish) and likewise Neptune needs to be mixed with something else, some other catalyst, to have an outward effect.

"everything has to weave in seamlessly such that the story oozes like water and ppl intuitively get 'it' right away."

Sounds happy.

[rietje1]

Ava,

Wow I love that description of Venus-Saturn. Maybe it steers your Sag Venus towards a certain path but without making you hold back too much of that energy. I can see the argument for being okay with being alone, and thinking "quality over quantity" about friends. And glad for not taking it too hard when a group isn't right for them.

[anela]

I responded at LL, but I also have Uranus aspecting almost everything. I don't think I'm as likable as I used to be, but I don't always care at the moment.

I'm a member of different groups, and I sometimes fit in okay.. and then there will be the thing that separates me. You know? Like my sister said, I don't act like a normal person (I used to, but it's been a bit much in recent years). one group just had some drama, which is unusual from them, but not the one person who caused it, I guess. She messed with me a bit, about a week before my mum died. She tried to blackmail someone else, about her lifestyle. So those two have been posting a lot, and I'm trying to stay out of it. But I'm sick of people doing this kind of thing. Why do some people want to hurt others? I'm not the type to shun, I know people have issues, I used to understand people, even if I couldn't personally relate. If I set out to hurt people, I wouldn't expect anyone to back me up.