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Post by 12YearsABlob on Nov 6, 2018 1:54:56 GMT
- Tilda Swinton. (Source: This article).
One Neptunian talking about another. Swinton has a Sun-Neptune conjunction in Scorpio. David Bowie had Sun/Mars in the 12th, square Neptune. Funnily enough, that last sentence echoed what I was thinking about Sun-Neptune folks and 12th housers. They have different flavours, of course. But it seems like they belong to the same family. When Neptune, the great dissolver, meets Sun, the big *identity*, you get one that's hard to pin down.
Sun in the 12th, when they 'own it', are very adept at tapping into the collective subconscious, channeling people's fantasies in a way that looks effortless. They can hold conflicting identities with ease. Sun-Neptune folks can also do that, but it takes more time for them to come to terms with it.
They feel different, and are probably just as "out there" as some Uranian types. Unlike Uranian types though, theirs is a quiet rebellion. They're not necessarily trying to defy societal norms, they simply don't see what all the fuss is about.
They have a mellow, neutral vibe that sometimes manifests as an androgynous appearance (what's more neutral than something that has no particular gender?)
To some extent, I believe people with Sun-Neptune aspects stretch our boundaries of what it means to be a man or woman or person. They force us to reconsider what those roles mean, how we can express ourselves outside of any labels. For instance, seeing somebody like Bowie, opened everybody's minds to that kind of persona.
The flip side: With the hard aspects, there's the danger of seeing oneself only as the sum total of what people think you are. There's an elaborate false self that only acts in order to get a certain reaction/create a certain impression. The native may not even be aware of it. It's just one of the ways the ego might choose to deal with the absolute surrender that Neptune demands. It feels like shaky ground, so it is shored up by gathering the self-esteem-boost from others that is lacking in the self.
Ones that have worked on these issues, find that surrendering their notions of how they want to be seen, brings more joy than the promise of those accolades. A happy Sun-Neptune person is one who feels free to follow their own path, without the stress of material expectations.
What do you guys think? What have you noticed about people that have such aspects?
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Post by 12YearsABlob on Nov 6, 2018 2:10:35 GMT
Examples:
- Anthony Hopkins. Sun in the 12th, Asc trine Neptune (Ref: This article).
“I don’t want life to imitate art. I want life to be art.”
“No motive is pure. No one is good or bad-but a hearty mix of both. And sometimes life actually gives to you by taking away.”
Lady Gaga: Sun square Mars-Neptune, Moon-Pluto sextile Neptune. Kristen Stewart: Sun opp. Moon, both square Neptune. Ellen DeGeneres: Sun-Venus square Neptune-Jupiter. Carl Jung: Sun-Dsc squaring Neptune. Edward Norton: Sun square Neptune-Asc.
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Post by 12YearsABlob on Nov 6, 2018 2:22:56 GMT
More examples:
Michelle Williams: Sun conj. Moon, both square Neptune. Interestingly enough, she played Marylin Monroe - another Neptunian character. Marie Antoinette: Sun-Venus square Neptune. Frédéric Chopin: Sun-Dsc-Venus-Pluto square Neptune-Saturn. (I know right, wow.).
Coco Chanel: Sun-Venus square Neptune. Franklin D. Roosevelt: Sun-Venus square Neptune-Saturn, Sun square Jupiter. Morgan Freeman: Sun square Neptune. Ella Fitzgerald: Sun-Venus square Neptune. Matthew Perry: Sun square Neptune. Donald Glover: Sun square Neptune.
Jane Austen: Sun-IC square Neptune-Asc Diane Keaton: Sun-Venus square Neptune Marcel Proust: Sun-Merc square Neptune-Asc, Sun conjunct Jupiter. Patti Smith: Sun square Neptune-MC. Howard Stern: Sun opp. Uranus, both squaring Neptune. Tchaikovsky: Sun-Mars opposing Jupiter, t-squaring Neptune.
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Post by 12YearsABlob on Nov 6, 2018 2:36:41 GMT
Celebrities with Sun in the 12th:
Jodie Foster Kanye West (also has Sun conjunct Jupiter, opposing Neptune) Katy Perry Madonna
Meryl Streep Charlize Theron David Beckham Orlando Bloom Michelle Pfeiffer Joseph Stalin George W Bush Roger Federer Janis Joplin Camilla, Duchess of Cornwall Hugh Grant Liv Tyler Johnny Cash Linda Goodman Richard Branson Mark Ruffalo Asia Argento Mao Zedong Diego Maradona David Letterman Immanuel Kant |
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Post by Ava on Nov 6, 2018 3:17:04 GMT
I love your thoughts here, 12YearsABlob . Just looked at some charts: Jazz Jennings has draco Neptune exactly or tightly conjunct sun. Caitlyn Jenner has 12H Mercury-Neptune conjunct SN. Chelsea Manning his Pisces NN square sun. All nodal stuff. I don't know any other famous transgender people (or can't think of them at the moment). Elvis was a draco Pisces sun, one of the first to break gender-wardrobe rules in public, wearing pink blouses with frills and stuff. But I think I'm off the mark..... "I believe people with Sun-Neptune aspects stretch our boundaries of what it means to be a man or woman or person." Well a sun-Neptune friend put me through training to see the world as an animist would and I have never been the same. Actually my inner child was an animist, believing the world was conscious...it just took some "glue" to connect my young impressions with a more developed intellect, years later. (My sun's in mutual reception with 12H Saturn if that counts for anything). I'm reading books about animism/shamanism now... John Perkins is the author of one: sun trine Neptune twilightstarsong.blogspot.com/2013/08/john-perkins-economic-hitman-turned.htmlDavid Abram: sun trine Neptune ...Weirdly his draco sun @ 13 Scorpio, draco Neptune 10 Pisces overlaps the current tropical alignment Richard Tarnas gets into animism in Cosmos & Psyche (such an amazing book!) He's a Pisces sun ^ Point with that is, to be a person is NOT to be isolated from nature, but wholly enmeshed with a resonant environment, so that the human experience is meant to be much more expansive and perceptive than society currently envisions it. That "stretches the boundaries of what it means to be a person."  |
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Post by 12YearsABlob on Nov 6, 2018 5:48:46 GMT
I love your thoughts here, 12YearsABlob . Just looked at some charts: Jazz Jennings has draco Neptune exactly or tightly conjunct sun. Caitlyn Jenner has 12H Mercury-Neptune conjunct SN. Chelsea Manning his Pisces NN square sun. All nodal stuff. I don't know any other famous transgender people (or can't think of them at the moment). Thanks! Glad you liked the thread.. And that's interesting about transgender celebrities. Although I wasn't thinking of transgender folks per se. Just that people like Tilda, or Bowie (even Frida Kahlo), naturally embody gender fluidity to some extent. That's one of the ways it could manifest, yes, but the boundary-blurring could take any form. For instance, between "self" & nature, as you mentioned (Richard Tarnas), between self and others, between male and female, appropriate and inappropriate, etc... Elvis was a draco Pisces sun, one of the first to break gender-wardrobe rules in public, wearing pink blouses with frills and stuff. But I think I'm off the mark..... Nah, you're not. I do think draconic and =nodal stuff has echoes of this. Well, maybe in different ways, but it has some ties to the same theme. For instance, my draconic sun conj tropical Neptune resonates with all this, to some extent. Well, not the androgynous expression, but some other types. Speaking of Elvis, what you described is exactly the vibe I was talking about. He did that, it was controversial as heck - but women were (and are) crazy about him. Doesn't make him less attractive, or less manly or whatever. Ditto with Bowie. Isn't it strange, we are fed this script of what a man (or woman) should be like? We adopt it, to varying degrees. And then life spins us around and shakes us awake. We find ourselves rather taken with something we were told we surely would *not* (should not) like. If he is not X, Y, Z, he is not a 'real man'. But there's more than one way to skin a cat, and there's more than one way to be a man. I hope people like them inspire more guys to be themselves no matter what. Well, to each his own, people may or may not find it attractive - but the point is it's not 'wrong'. Well a sun-Neptune friend put me through training to see the world as an animist would and I have never been the same. Actually my inner child was an animist, believing the world was conscious...it just took some "glue" to connect my young impressions with a more developed intellect, years later. (My sun's in mutual reception with 12H Saturn if that counts for anything). *nodding* And the Pisces moon. David Abram: sun trine Neptune ...Weirdly his draco sun @ 13 Scorpio, draco Neptune 10 Pisces overlaps the current tropical alignment Aah, what a good time to be discussing this.. |
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Post by midnight on Nov 6, 2018 12:33:14 GMT
Well, hello!
12H Sun here ( which is also a Ruler of my 12H) trine Neptune. My Venus is also in 12H.
Thank you for this thread, it was interesting to read. I don't know what to say, some of it fits, some doesn't. I need to get my thoughts together. I'll be back <3
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Post by Ava on Nov 8, 2018 0:56:55 GMT
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Post by 12YearsABlob on Nov 8, 2018 1:47:51 GMT
Well, hello! 12H Sun here ( which is also a Ruler of my 12H) trine Neptune. My Venus is also in 12H. Thank you for this thread, it was interesting to read. I don't know what to say, some of it fits, some doesn't. I need to get my thoughts together. I'll be back <3 P.S. I do think there are also important differences between the two (12H Sun & Sun-Neptune), but my thoughts up there are more influenced by Sun-Neptune. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2018 3:58:07 GMT
I have a lot of thoughts about this and I’ll second the difference between 12th sun and sun-Neptune, and sun-Neptune hard aspects.
Alex Honnold for example has sun trine Neptune. In interviews he talked about spending about a year visualizing his climb and choreographing all his moves so the actual journey is realized/materialized. I’ll say that this characteristic applies for Pisces placements as well.
Sun in 12th however likes to be behind the scene. Planets in 12th in general like to avoid caucophony of general human existences because they’re overwhelmed by their own sensitivity and tend to find themselves best in alone time. Sun in 12th can be very independent and might go off on independent adventures as well, but this applies to sun-Neptune conjunction and trine as well.
Sun-Neptune conjunction or trine don’t seem to require alone time. They might enjoy it or not but might not require it for their own sanity.
Also sun in 12th or planets in 12th tend to be overwhelmed with their own sensitivity towards others.
Sun Neptune can just be overall submerged in their environment or have problems seeing themselves FROM their environment
Sun Neptune hard aspects including conjunction can have problems with reality as well. I’m not saying they all are delusional but reality can be too harsh and they shun away from it.
Planets in 12th don’t exactly shun reality. They just avoid ppl and stay in the background for sometime to work on themselves but there’s this awareness like: wait wait wait what’s this? What are all these sensory responses and who am I?
Obviously pathology’s found in any placement so I’m not indicating that anyone with any aspect has mental problem.
Also hard aspects to Neptune can indicate unfulfilled dreams, lots of disappointments that lead to a pessimistic, overly sobering attitude towards life
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Post by 12YearsABlob on Nov 8, 2018 4:22:59 GMT
Sun Neptune hard aspects including conjunction can have problems with reality as well. I’m not saying they all are delusional but reality can be too harsh and they shun away from it. Planets in 12th don’t exactly shun reality. They just avoid ppl and stay in the background for sometime to work on themselves but there’s this awareness like: wait wait wait what’s this? What are all these sensory responses and who am I? Many good points there, @theunknown . Thanks for posting!
This part especially reminded me of the Anthony Hopkins quote above.
12th house suns that have worked through this energy have the knowledge (and awareness) that Sun-Neptune folks are unconsciously seeking.
12th house energy is hard to get a hold of for the native themselves, because it's so vast, not to mention nebulous. A Sun-Neptune person is sorta like Kitty Pryde from X-men, regardless of their environment. With the 12th house, it's like they're permanently housed at the bottom of the sea and have to learn to interact with the world outside without disintegrating when they come into contact with it.
...Just thinking out loud here, let me know if it makes sense. Always appreciate your insights.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2018 6:11:18 GMT
12YearsABlob exactly! Actually I know quite a few sun in 12th and they tend to be shy... not reserved (which is sun in 6th) but shy, uncertain of who they are, uncomfortable with shining but rather prefer someone else mentioning their accomplishments. Obviously the whole chart needs to be taken into account but the sun in 12th alone has troubles asserting themselves. They’d much rather be in the background because they’re self-dismissive. Some 12th suns can become overprotective of their sanctuary later in life (Jodie Foster) because they eventually learn what exactly about themselves that need to be out there and what needn’t be
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2018 5:43:59 GMT
Btw neptunian/jupiterian/12th housers are kinda eccentric ... i think ppl confuse aquarius a lot with pisces. Pisceans/Neptunian/12th housers are truly non-judgmental and weird lol
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Post by 12YearsABlob on Nov 9, 2018 10:02:09 GMT
^I love him! Saw him on Criminal Minds first. Mars-Jupiter conjunction in Virgo, and a playful Sag moon. He's got a real knack for comedy. Talented artist too - posts his sketches on instagram. And yeah I do think Neptunian energy is non-judgmental (the other two you mentioned can go either way - Piscean is not quite the same as Neptunian - but that's just my experience, it could be that I just happened to meet some like that). P.S. I've seen Aquarius & Pisces get together romantically fairly often. Two trans-personal signs find it easier to connect, I suppose. They have similar styles of relating and broad-strokes compassion as opposed to focussed, individual care. If a personal sign gets mixed up with them, it's hard for them to feel 'personally' loved. But these two understand each other pretty well. |
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