Comparing progressed composite and comp w.transits

[Deleted]

Which would be more predictive of the current situation or what would be the relative strengths of a progressed composite versus a composite with transits. Or better still, a progressed comp with transits. 

Is there another version that I haven't thought of?

As examples, I've posted each with transits:

Composite w. transits



The main transits (taking only exact aspects) appear to be:
t sun square c sun
t venus conj c Uranus
t Uranus trine c Mars and c Jupiter


Progressed w. transits


While Venus has moved to the 1st house, 3 planets - Uranus, Saturn and Neptune at the 29th degrees. Also Pluto squares Saturn. This looks severe as if certain things will come to completion - lessons learnt even if harsh lessons. Transits to this seem rather redundant. The do, however, cast a harmonising influence:
t Mars sextile c NN
t Neptune sextile c Mars
t Pluto sextile c Venus

[Ava]

Hi @astrokeen

'Hard to say...I haven't been doing astrology long enough to have an informed opinion.

Relative to the charts above, you seem pessimistic about the condition of the relationship (?) Tr Venus on composite Uranus, love seems wobbly and uncertain now?

But to me it looks like something is set to break open with transiting NN conjunct comp Uranus, possibly at the same time as the progressed composite moon moves into a Pythagorean triangle with Pluto and Saturn, and tr Mars will be conjunct Chiron?

I mean if anything is finished...why would it be finished now, before everything comes into alignment at once (if those transits are indeed synchronized to hit all at once)? In my experience, usually several things are going on, all together.

Tr Jupiter will also soon enough turn direct and then revisit that 1H pr comp stellium -- I can't imagine *nothing* happening while this is going on. It also moves into the regular composite's 3H, expanding communication (possibly a sticking point, with Scorpio Saturn there, maybe some spells of eerie silence between you, or unaddressed tension that doesn't get directly addressed?) But then again, that Saturn is sextile to the ASC-sun-Mercury and may have a preservative effect on long-haul communication.

I'd be surprised if things fell apart NOW, if there's any turbulence I would blame tr Venus on comp Uranus opp comp Chiron with Mars nearby.......

Pr comp Mars isn't strongly aspected, so if there's a "dead in the water" feeling, that could contribute to it, plus it's getting squeezed by tr Saturn and Pluto, not exactly a picture of comfort. But the sextile to Venus may tighten up soon (?) I don't know their relative speeds.

If I could give advice, it might be, hold your fire when transiting planets oppose that Mars, because it's kind of chilling out there, not feeling strong, not wanting provocation, especially not from quick-moving, hot-headed Cancer planets.

The underlying, stronger Mars story is that lovely grand trine transiting Uranus forms with composite Mars and Jupiter, so that's the kind of energy to honor, the smooth and yet exciting rumble of well-grounded, positive earth energy.

Well, it's late and I'm squinting at the screen, forgive any errors here please, sometimes I see the charts with wonky-vision, I swear it's transiting Neptune on my moon, playing shell games with visual stimuli. lol

Anyway - bottom line, I'd check further ahead into the next month or two for more clues about where this is going.

[lumina]

Both. And especially of there IS an aspects from pr to n composite bthaz receives strong transits

[lumina]

@astrokeen

to be honest Pluto-Saturn in 4th harmonic aspects including the conjunction really sucks.
It`s metaphorically speaking like having to pull out a (possibly rotting) tooth by its roots (and without Neptune, probably the sedation will fail). That`s about the feeling and experiences Pluto-Saturn brings, it has been also likened to amputation btw.

Basil Fearrington calls it the "most difficult of all aspects in synastry" (and transits/ solar arc), David Cochrane describes it in a composite like this "Saturn-Pluto is going to mean things being removed from your life, you know, no dessert, no chocolate cake for you, no richness, bare bones"

And well the most devastating experience for me happened when we had Solar Arc Pluto in Scorpio in exact square to the natal composite Saturn in Leo in 7th house (Saturn rules the 12th in composite chart, Pluto rules the 10th and was located in the 10th - yes it came from an external source somehow, and sort of like from the underground at the same time).

I am not putting that here to spread doom and gloom, as I find that silly and unneccessary, but Saturn-Pluto is just when a harsh reality is coming into the union, like a wall, and ignoring it won`t make it go away.

What it is about at the bottom however the need to transform something, and in this case, transform the substance, foundation, that what you sthought was most basic and stable, sometimes taking away all that you thought of as solid or even as a ground-pattern of relating. Some of this needs to be removed, and yes, it usually involves some kind of sacrifice (as people do not want to change on that basic level, it feels threatening to their existence).

However what Saturn-Pluto is ALSO, is a wake-up-call, a chance for one of the greatest and long lasting transformations to take place. Something might be removed from your life (and it could also be a thoughtpattern btw, I guess it depends what Saturn is doing in the chart, and Pluto), and a part of life will be utterly changed, but from that point on something new will emerge and (re)built. Something much more realistic. (it was what followed our Solar arc Pluto-Saturn-square, too, btw).

Also I have had that for the last year Tr Pluto opposing natal SAturn and right now I have Tr Saturn squaring Pluto (well it backs off again for a while for now), and I am still wondering what was removed, but then again also thinking back I`ve been through some of the harsher experiences/ times in my life, which made me having to adjust my dealing with the real stuff.
And while I am not totally sure I interprete it right, there has been loss, I had to deal with somehow (though in a way it was more of the indirect type, not affecting me very directly, but I`d say 2nd degree directness. lol) and there has also been additions to my life, which was also a huge transformation - both of these things called me to face reality and act accordingly. No more hiding in the shadows for example. Does not work anymore. Of course it took away a form of safetyblanket, and at the same time it opened my look for different perceptions (on myself as well). Also my boss changed. It sounds weird, but this REALLY wore me down; he was the one who was employing me, and despite him having some negative sides to him, I`ve always been sort of feeling thankful through that, and he was the one most happy when he could hand me the certificate for my promotion to a civil servant (which brings greater financial security). And I do not handle changes well. lol It was depressing to me, though I must say the transition - so far, but let`s wait how things evolve. lol- has been pretty smooth.

But I`ve been having to face different challenges as well (my natal Pluto is in my 10th house, ruling my 11th and 12th), including having to do final exams for the first time, and I am just always worried that I did not teach them well, or whatever. WEll so far my pupils were making pretty good exams, at least in my subject, and the oral exams I had to do with some of them, went exceptionally well. Of course I was also having great pupils who were realizing that a lot of the results will be dependent on the working they put into it before. But I would have felt lousy if they had not had good marks in the end (curiously that was more important to me than my own marks used to be. lol)
And one pupil was asking me for a voluntary oral exam to improve her mark even more (yes it is possible) - by the way that was one pupil who came to me 3 years ago, into my course, with a medical certificiate that she cannot do oral exams or even presentations in class or even being called to an answer in class because of social and performance anxiety.
WEll and she wants to do a voluntary oral exam now. I would NEVER have done that, and I was not diagnosed with social anxiety. lol But I guess she really grew in those last 3 years as a person, and maybe, partly I mananged with the help of the class of course, to provide a rather calm and peaceful environment without too much pressure. Another pupil was also diagnosed with that and in the first months not even able to attend to class out of anxiety. Well we have been talking a lot (and I did not pressure her to come to class, just asked her to let me know where she was and giving her tasks to do outside the classroom). At the end of those 3 years she was my most active pupil in class. So I guess something must have gone right.

But anyway that task to do oral exams for pupils as final exams, it is a HIGH demand, at least I feel like that. And I am a worrier. lol But this time I could not avoid it (Saturn-Pluto does not allow for avoidance, no matter how much you want to take the path of least resistance, wait for a nice jupiter or neptune transit for that, not Saturn-Pluto).

So I`d say, it is not always bad, it does feel like that insurmountable mountain in front of you, it does remove certain things from your life (in my case the liberty to hide away), but it also transforms you and makes you access the reality.

And now that is important, reality does not always have to suck. Sometimes you might even realize something is better, more worthwhile more lasting than you thought it would be! THAT is a transformantion, too. It could be an end, or a new beginning. or both.


In your case that Saturn-Pluto already is separating again, just by 7 minutes, so you are in the aftermath of it, and whenever something strong aspects it, you fill feel that neccessity to transform, this feeling as if things are so important, on life and death, black and white. But it is separating, and both planets are progressing very slowly, keep that in mind, so a 7 minute orb might actually point to an event some months or even years? ago.


So what has been removed from your relationship or your lives through the relationship? What has been transformed? What has turned out to be the reality, that point where you have to face up to how things really are?

The answer on these questions will tell you what Saturn-Pluto is really about for you. Hey, who knows? Maybe it was even something that made you more solid, more sincere as a couple? Or it made you realize that what you have is just not enough? Whatever it is, there are no excuses possible, no going around the truth, no escaping into the land of "how it could be", that is Neptunes ressort, Saturn-Pluto wants you to face what IS, and if you don`t like it, to change it.

[lumina]

Also be glad it is not tight in your natal composite. Well I personally wouldn`t want to have to deal with Saturn-Pluto as part of the basic composite, describing an integral part of the union. (It`s just too exhausting and unfeeling to me). 

But as part of a temporary thing or lesson or development I`d think it should be manageable if the union at basic is healthy and really strong. (it has to be very strong though to survive this, but if you have survived it so far, I would say it is a sign you two ARE very well matched)


Also it is generational and slow, so I think the real challenges await when there will be personal planets or an angle progressing into conjunction, square, opposition or even a quinkunx to that. 

[Deleted]

Ava , lumina , thank you very much. Will read, reflect and be back.

This relationship has been cyclical in nature - at times too rollercoastish to stomach, which we somehow seem to stick through. I have wondered if an ending might be a good thing and if the time might be now. But, again, have been through these meanderings before.

Edit: 
Ava , thank you for a really interesting analysis and some lovely insights, highlighting many things I had overlooked. I am very interested to see how those alignments manifest. Much more detached now after the experience of 'nothingness', less 'hot-headed' but interested enough to want to see what happens next . 

lumina , your interpretation of Saturn/Pluto is true is so many ways. The fact one may lose something which "also transforms you and makes you access the reality" hits the nail on the head. And it will be me accessing reality alone, not as a couple, which, come to think of it, is a necessary step towards psychological health. The difficulty is that that is one way of looking at it. Possibly. Saturn is forcing me to make a choice which is why I seek clues through astrology. 

Funnily enough, the square between Saturn and Pluto was exact to the minute when we reconnected after a period of estrangement over 2 years ago. That point was marked by an acceptance of the reality then and greater honesty with oneself.