Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2018 18:31:01 GMT
I've read many accounts of what happens when we die. These have been refreshingly positive and different from the 'doomed to eternity' scenarios of both Christianity and Hinduism. In Hinduism one is doomed to an endless cycle of rebirths from which there is no escape.
Writers like Brian Weiss discovered very similar accounts from people through regression - which were a surprise to him, as he did not initially believe in life after death. His book "Many Lives Many Masters' is a fascinating read (Plan to read his "Same Soul Many Bodies" one day). These accounts corresponded to those of people who had reported near death experiences (NDEs), particularly the experience of traveling through a tunnel of light and being greeted by relatives. However, the key message was that the soul makes choices about their evolution - whether that is a rebirth in a context of their own choosing or another realm. The soul is all knowing, and with the help of beings who advise and support the process, they choose the next stage of their evolution. This may involve returning to earth to revisit experiences or learnings which may not have been successful in the previous existence. And therein lies the 'karma'. There is no punishment as such or, conversely, rewards.
I think I read in a channelled book (possibly in "Conversations with God") that a Robin Williams film "What Dreams May Come" is a close representation of an after death experience, although it's not entirely accurate. What the film communicates very well is that upon death the initial experiences are based upon one's expectations and can be controlled by one's imagination.
There are of course a huge number of questions I would like to ask: where does this all lead to; what are we evolving towards; is spiritual advancement (as in meditating) different from being ethical, i.e., learning about compassion and tolerance; can one be born in different worlds, etc., etc.
I would like to post some accounts from different writers below as and when I come across them. Would be good to see who is saying what. I hope others will contribute too.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2018 22:53:21 GMT
"Seth Speaks" by Jane RobertsThis is a channelled book which goes into detail about after death states - some key passages can be read here: thesearchforlifeafterdeath.com/2015/11/21/jane-roberts-seth-describes-our-life-after-death/A few quotes - On the initial condition of arriving in the spirit world:
"A belief in hell fires can cause you to hallucinate Hades’ conditions. A belief in a stereotyped heaven can result in a hallucination of heavenly conditions. You always form your own reality according to your ideas and expectations. This is the nature of consciousness in whatever reality it finds itself. Such hallucinations, I assure you, are temporary. […] There are teachers to explain the conditions and circumstances. You are not left alone, therefore, lost in mazes of hallucination. You may or may not realize immediately that you are dead in physical terms." On the Life Review:
"You examine the fabric of the existence you have left, and you learn to understand how your experiences were the result of your own thoughts and emotions and how these affected others. Until this examination is through, you are not yet aware of the larger portions of your own identity." On remembering past lives and choosing a new one:
"When you realize the significance and meaning of the life you have just left, then you are ready for conscious knowledge of your other existences. You become aware, then, of an expanded awareness. What you are begins to include what you have been in other lives, and you begin to make plans for your next physical existence, if you decide upon one. You can instead enter another level of reality, and then return to a physical existence if you choose."
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2018 23:02:16 GMT
I'm deeply fascinated by this topic as I strongly believe in the afterlife, reincarnation and NDEs. I too believe that we don't get punished ever by anyone, and the only source of punishment is our own conscience if it feels guilty/tortured etc. There is no judgment up there (it's such a human construct), love is pure and unconditional, and there is complete freedom to move about. I believe that you don't have to reincarnate on the same planet again and again. You can choose to experience life on other planets or dimensions or planes of existence, or maybe even on the same planet but just a different dimension. Either that or you can choose to just stay up there, or be a guide to other souls who have chosen to reincarnate. The possibilities are literally limitless because a soul is completely self-aware, and once you're truly self-aware, you can practice true free-will. There are of course a huge number of questions I would like to ask: where does this all lead to; what are we evolving towards; is spiritual advancement (as in meditating) different from being ethical, i.e., learning about compassion and tolerance; can one be born in different worlds, etc., etc. I ask myself some of these questions too, especially the "what's the point of existing?". Say every single soul everywhere that exists learns absolutely everything there is to learn or experiences absolutely everything there is to experience (not sure it's possible but let's just say hypothetically), then where to next? I'm still wondering what we are evolving towards.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2018 3:13:55 GMT
I'm deeply fascinated by this topic as I strongly believe in the afterlife, reincarnation and NDEs. I too believe that we don't get punished ever by anyone, and the only source of punishment is our own conscience if it feels guilty/tortured etc. There is no judgment up there (it's such a human construct), love is pure and unconditional, and there is complete freedom to move about. I believe that you don't have to reincarnate on the same planet again and again. You can choose to experience life on other planets or dimensions or planes of existence, or maybe even on the same planet but just a different dimension. Either that or you can choose to just stay up there, or be a guide to other souls who have chosen to reincarnate. The possibilities are literally limitless because a soul is completely self-aware, and once you're truly self-aware, you can practice true free-will. Very well put, @sopranosoul, I guess this comprises the new age view. I find it uplifting and liberating. Was there any particular writer or book that you found helpful in this regard?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2018 7:21:10 GMT
@astrokeen
I think it was a whole combination of experiences that gradually led me to this way of thinking (though I've always instinctively believed in reincarnation since I first learned what it's about). There are some key people/books who have made me come to this realisation:
One is a famous researcher called Dr Ian Stevenson who has studied over 1000 cases of what seems to be reincarnation. However, his research wasn't about morality or explaining how or why reincarnation works so much as suggesting its potential existence.
I am friends with a girl who has made me see life in a new perspective by introducing me to law of attraction (which is something I never really gave much attention to before). It's made me realise that we're born to be creators.
I read a book called "Real Alien Worlds", which was basically an encyclopaedia of different alien races that have been studied through a specific type of astral projection. It was a fascinating book, though the author David Mccready (whom I actually met in real life) unfortunately does his book a disservice by being a greedy, money-hungry individual and doesn't quite live up to his "unconditional love" insistence, which is rather a pity as he propounds it so much in his book. At any rate, even if what he wrote about is not completely true, it still opened my mind up to different sorts of possibilities.
I also met a medium who has been able to see spirits since childhood (and her memory even regressed back to when she was in her mother's womb), and speaking to her has further helped me understand exactly what's out there. She's a lovely woman who actually DOES live and breathe unconditional love. She introduced me to my spirit guides.
|
|
|
Post by Violets on Jan 31, 2018 17:53:48 GMT
The more information I take in on this topic, the more I begin to suspect that what happens to us after we die may be as unique as what happens while we're alive.
|
|
|
Post by 12YearsABlob on Jan 31, 2018 18:23:12 GMT
Interesting thread, @astrokeen ! Bound to spark a lot of discussion. The possibilities are endless. In Hinduism one is doomed to an endless cycle of rebirths from which there is no escape.. Well, there's the concept of ' moksha', as far as I remember. One of the main *goals* of the soul, in Hinduism, is liberation from the cycle of death and rebirth. That's why the concept of karma is crucial here, because it is believed that every incarnation is a result of previous incarnations on earth. The soul and God are considered equal in every respect (i.e. they are one)* and liberation is the result of the soul recognizing its own divinity. That's when our sense of individuality is dissolved and it merges with the omnipresent 'God'. ' Samadhi' is that state of oneness with God. When the soul is in absolute harmony with the rest of the cosmos. I believe this is why Yogis would take off and leave all their worldly possessions behind. To completely immerse themselves in meditation, ' dhyana', a fully conscious effort to exit one's body. Sometimes they choose an element to disappear into. Water, air, earth, fire - they surrender themselves to an element of their choosing. *Side note: There's another school of thought which maintains one's spiritual identity *while* at the same time, recognizing it's divinity. It's slightly more complicated than I can handle explaining. Just making a note that this is (also) one of the beliefs held by a certain group.
|
|
|
Post by anela on Jan 31, 2018 18:42:41 GMT
I'm still having trouble seeing it as anything other than a sadistic/masochistic cycle, that sometimes has its good times. Sorry. My Uncle, who was a tough former boxer, and was the sort to have no time for this sort of thing, died on the operating table, over twenty years ago. He passed away in the early 2000's, but when he was brought back from that, he reckoned he came up off that bed, wanting to punch the person who brought him back. It sounded like the operating table, but that would be impossible, so it must have been his recovery bed. He said he was totally at peace, and floating somewhere. He was not happy that he was brought back. I know some talk about "the god part of the brain" and how it just seems to give us a nice send-off as our body is dying, but he was a different man after that. Before he died for good, he had a health problem, and he finally put his wife into a home. She had alzheimer's. He did the best he could to take care of her - a guy who had cheated on her before, and not always been the best husband, did the best he could for her, until he realized he could no longer handle it. He died in the early hours of the morning, after coming home from putting her in that home.
|
|
|
Post by Violets on Jan 31, 2018 18:49:44 GMT
Where I'm at with this concept (and why my responses are rather vague) is that I now spend a lot of time contemplating lost souls (ghosts, human spirits, whatever name one chooses to give), souls who are stuck on this plane for their own reasons or due to circumstances beyond their control during life...
I don't believe in the idea of Heaven or Hell as it's commonly described, or as a form of punishment and reward. I likewise don't believe that karma is something along those lines, punishment/reward in the terms it's commonly understood.
I do believe we incarnate in different forms, different planes. I also believe that we do create contracts with other souls throughout these incarnations, which is similar to the idea of karma, in a way.
I don't know if I think there's an ultimate goal, like a finish line of some sort.
|
|
|
Post by 12YearsABlob on Jan 31, 2018 19:48:41 GMT
I do believe we incarnate in different forms, different planes. I also believe that we do create contracts with other souls throughout these incarnations, which is similar to the idea of karma, in a way. I don't know if I think there's an ultimate goal, like a finish line of some sort. ^ Yeah, this is pretty much what I think I believe at this point. I have no concrete opinions on much of this - it's too vast and mysterious. Looking forward to reading more.
|
|
|
Post by 12YearsABlob on Jan 31, 2018 19:57:08 GMT
He passed away in the early 2000's, but when he was brought back from that, he reckoned he came up off that bed, wanting to punch the person who brought him back. I would too. Sorry to hear about him. <3
|
|
|
Post by Violets on Jan 31, 2018 19:59:34 GMT
I have no concrete opinions on much of this - it's too vast and mysterious. I agree, it's a bit difficult to form any definitive opinion on it.
|
|
|
Post by Violets on Jan 31, 2018 21:16:30 GMT
anela, your uncle's experiences sound amazing, sad, and beautiful all at once. Thank you for sharing that. ❤
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2018 23:01:20 GMT
Glad we all agree that the karmic cycle of reward and punishment is antagonistic to the notion of an enlightened loving universal soul. Violets , I have read explanations of the lower astral planes and the lost souls that frequent it. Hope to find some to paste here. 12YearsABlob ,Hinduism seems to offer two alternatives: the individual is either doomed to a cycle of incessant rebirths to resolve one's karma or the individual can gain release through meditative practices that lead to moksha or liberation. The latter is not a easy path and may take a few lifetimes to achieve. It is very well explained in "Autobiography of a Yogi", which speaks of the stages of progression thru the astral and the causal worlds. However, if one does not embark on a path towards self- realization, the individual is subject to strict laws of karma where she must pay for wrongs committed or reap the rewards of good deeds. Hinduism does not accord the individual with free will and self determination after death. The narrative of a self - aware soul attempting to do its best to evolve is entirely missing.
|
|
|
Post by Violets on Jan 31, 2018 23:12:01 GMT
There are so many cultures with such completely different ideas about these things, it's really hard to say anything about it, I think.
When I was a teenager I bought a copy of The Tibetan Book of the Dead. I couldn't understand it for anything, and some of the concepts freaked me out, to be honest. Likewise when I was in my twenties, and read all of the Don Juan books by Carlos Castenada.
I take such beliefs into consideration more now than I did then.
|
|
|
Post by anela on Jan 31, 2018 23:41:09 GMT
anela , your uncle's experiences sound amazing, sad, and beautiful all at once. Thank you for sharing that. ❤ He was my great uncle, more like a grandfather to me. I didn't know either of mine. He wasn't a totally awful person before, he just screwed up like a lot of people do. After his experience, he started sharing poetry that he'd written for years. He published a few of them online, after winning something. I've just found him on My Heritage, so I might join it for free, for two weeks, and see what I can add. He died in 2000, and mum knew something was wrong, because she couldn't sleep. I hope his experience was real. Last April, I read stories about bedside visitations, before people died. I have another book that I bought just after mum... damn it, I can't say it. Anyway, a day or two after the funeral. One story made me laugh, because it's what I've pictured me doing: a woman's husband appeared to her, and rather than it being a transcendent experience, she screamed. I wish I could get some proof. My uncle's experience was the closest I've come to it, that I can remember. I was obsessed with this subject for years, and then became disenchanted with it all. My sister said she saw a woman once, and it turned out to be a deceased aunt that we didn't know well. We were sleeping in what had been her bed, with my Uncle A. I felt something was wrong, but didn't see anything, and asked to get in between her and my mum. Hopefully, she was just visiting, and wasn't trapped. They were divorced when she died. I hate to think of anyone being stuck here. Dad said something like that about mum, and the hospital, too.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2018 0:14:20 GMT
Just a few weeks before my mum passed away she was hospitalized. While there she began to see spirits. She reported that there was a priest or a holy man who managed a group of healing Angels. He would assign them patients to take care of. My mum too had one. My mum continued to see two guides that stayed by her side till the end. She described them in great detail and wondered why they were there at all.
|
|
|
Post by Violets on Feb 1, 2018 0:56:08 GMT
That's so beautiful and heartening, @astrokeen. 💖
|
|
|
Post by lumina on Feb 1, 2018 12:18:14 GMT
the only source of punishment is our own conscience if it feels guilty/tortured etc. There is no judgment up there (it's such a human construct), love is pure and unconditional, and there is complete freedom to move about.
just felt like really emphasizing this.
|
|
|
Post by Ava on Feb 1, 2018 14:30:06 GMT
I love that point you made, too @sopranosoul. Some people seem to have no conscience, but I believe it's always there, if only in the subconscious; it will get to people in nightmares, or maybe after they die it comes alive again. I once had a dream that I semi-accidentally killed someone I loved (pushed them down the stairs). The regret I felt in that dream is the worst feeling I ever had about anything. It was sheer torture. Hell coming from the inside. --- I love this whole thread, hence all the likes. Thanks for sharing your thoughts, everyone.
|
|